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Tuesday, December 03, 2013

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Ellsbury to Yanks.

For reportedly more than Crawford got.

Didn't signing high-priced FAs used to be an exciting, positive thing? Now it feels like nothing but dodged bullets and sighs of relief.

Don't forget Jim Johnson and Luke Gregorson to the A's as well.

Heath Bell to the Rays.

More action today than the Trade Deadline.

As far as Nieves goes, I can't WAIT to hear RAJ's explanation of that one. And yep. he's comical.

There's no excitement surrounding the Phillies. Even Hamels was quoted saying they're not going to win 100 games this year ... not the attitude you want from what I would consider is the team's leader now.

Lets be real, the Phils will be in a fight for last place in the NL East with the Met and Marlins, and may just win that battle.

FWIW- I'm with Unikruk on this. Free agents used to be a huge deal but anymore it feels like we are just hoping our team doesn't take a bullet to the leg.

Ellsebury is a good player but 7 years? Seriously?

Let's be real, GM Carson will continue to write sh!tty blog posts trying desperately to be clever but just proving himself to be some knuckle dragging meathead.

That's Captain Hindsight :)

"Knuckle dragging meathead", I'll add that to my trophy collection on the mantle.

By the way, Truth Injection, I thought we had a truce. Also, do you read my blog, or are you making an uninformed assertion?

Carson: What the hell are you talking about? I didn't say a word to you in here. And to shamelessly rip off Mitch Hedberg. I read your website once, that's why I didn't read it twice.

Cap'n Hindsight - Nieves made $750k and I'm assuming he signed for at least $1M.

Still the point stands about this being a waste of money that would be better used elsewhere. Yeah $2M isn't going to 'make or break' the Phils but that isn't the point.

Point is that Amaro wasted at least $2M on Frandsen/Nieves when he had much cheaper and likely better younger internal options already available.

It isn't that offseason that boggle my mind though is has been the in-season roster f@ckups and bizarre moves the past few seasons to me that send up huge red flags about Amaro. He isn't even operationally sound as a GM.

Who the hell is Mitch Hedberg?

And c'mon, Captain Hindsight was one minute after your post. Coincidence? Hmm...

Whatever. I fell into the trap again.

Moving on.

First off- how does someone not know Mitch Hedberg? Guy was a comic genius.

Secondly- I barely have enough time to post under one screen name instead of two. Besides- if I think you are a dope I will just tell you. No need for me to hide under a second screen name. Even though you did threaten to come kick my ass one time.

Who is Mitch Hedberg? Really?

Jacoby Ellsbury? A seven-year ~!@#$ contract in excess of $150 million? This BS makes Rizzo and the Jayson Werth deal look like the catch of the century.

Jayson Werth wants so badly to play and win. I don't doubt for a nanosecond Werth still burns with desire for another ring, to the extent that he made the insane declaration no one in Philadelphia will ever have a parade again. Ever.

Ellsbury on cruise control after his ring? Not so much.

Just looked up Mitch Hedberg. Still don't know him. I've never been one to watch stand-up comedians.

TTI- you've read his site, so you can't be too surprised that the guy isn't exactly up on the greatest comedians of our time.

Still, though. Wow.

So, how did I rip off Mitch Hedberg?

"Cap'n Hindsight - Nieves made $750k and I'm assuming he signed for at least $1M."


MG, I'll bet you it's for LESS than $1MM.

I wonder if Boras steered Ellsbury to the Yankees just to piss off the Cano camp?


Also, are the Yankees superstitious?

The last time they signed away Boston's CF it eventually resulted in a WS win.

I've been the recipient of TTI's wrath more than enough times to know that he doesn't use fake Beerleaguer identities when he wants to insult someone. Captain Hindsight is Phlipper.

By the way, kudos to Corey for the punch line at the end of the thread header.

Most of these big-time FA contracts are a bloated disaster. The real contenders are built with home-grown talent, shrewd trades, and the occasional FA to plug a screaming need. It isn't rocket science.

Phils traded Kratz and Rob Rasmussen to blue jays for brad lincoln

GM Carson- I ripped him off in what I said. I'd tell you to look him up but his comedy is probably too cerebral for you. Focus on Carrot Top- he is probably your level.

cut: I like that you are back to "guys don't want it." Just a hunch- are you in your 60's and spend time talking about how "Back in my day guys would start both games of a doubleheader..."

bzp, you are correct: Credit where it is due: kudos to Corey.

Interesting move in trading Kratz basically for Lincoln. Ideally Lincoln's BB/9 was an aberration this past season. Bullpen depth I suppose.

Kratxz traded for Brad Lincoldn

Now you know "why" Nieves.

I just read a bunch of Hedberg quotes. Funny guy. I'd probably have enjoyed his comedy.

Oh, and that threatening to kick your ass. Well, I'm a non-violent man except when it comes to people repeatedly disrespecting me, so for you I'd make an exception.

Like TTI, I'm curious as to what everyone here that's whining and crying would rather the FO do this off-season.

We all collectively dreaded long-term deals to basically everyone in this free agent pool. Only Mr. Dodger Dollars wanted to go near any of the guys that have signed so far. But now that they're signing, people are whining that Amaro isn't 'going for it' and burying the team even more financially (of course if you believe MG, this Nieves signing has done that singlehandedly).

What exactly do you want them to do? Act like there's a chance to be competitive or not? Because the conventional wisdom for 6 months has been that they'll suck no matter what they do, so it's better they do nothing at all.

The two things that I do think are worth getting furious about:

1) Refusing to shop Lee at the peak of his value- its all downhill from here

2) Bringing Mayberry back and talking about how he's some great value because he's versatile (he can suck in all sorts of different ways at four different positions)

Hamels' comments are really interesting and you have to wonder who were the biggest critics/complainers and if any of the holdovers were among the culprits. More and more I do think Amaro made the right call to fire Cholly even if it was handled poorly and could have waited until they got home.

Still take good talent over chemistry 100/100 times on a baseball team but if things turn south early again this year with this team out of it by mid-season, you have to wonder how essentially the same roster will react.

Another "young" lefty. Goodbye Kratz. Hopefully we didn't unload a useful guy in Rassusman.

TTI - Enough damage for the day, no? Try lithium. Then add a SSRI.

You could look it up.

I predict there are more trades like this on the way:


One possibility (and I think a PROBABILITY) is that only one of Mayberry or Ruf will be on the roster come ST.

Crazy Prediction- Ruf traded to AL team where he goes on to have Brandon Moss like season, after being let go by Phils.

Clever cut.. Go commit harikiri.

Careful Iceman- You will get the FO apologist label again.

But honestly I'm with you and people ignore it because they would rather read visceral responses. I don't think anyone is happy with the off-season or the state of the team right now with Amaro as GM. We are marginally better than we were heading into 2013 at this point but after tasting playoff success for a sustained period of time that is the new norm for us as fans. We don't want to go back to the dark days but Amaro seems hell bent to drive us back there.

To me he had a few options considering this team "was not going to compete no matter what."

1.) Try and make some deals to bring in guys and help now without sacrificing the farm or long term futures.

2.) Shoot the moon and go Dodger Dollars on everyones ass giving up numerous draft picks and going all in with a 2, 7 off suit.

Of the two bad choices- he is doing the better of the two right now. Of course, I wish someone else were pulling the strings at this point.

Iceman - Did I ever say that about Nieves? It makes a bit more sense even though with the Kratz trade.

Actually like the Lincoln trade as long as the Phils can straighten out Lincoln's mechanics a bit. Certainly could use another hard-throwing RHP reliever to give them a bit more reliever depth.

Carson, that would not surprise me.

I can see something like this:

Ruf and one of the hard throwing young relievers (Diekman/De Fratus/Rosenberg/Aumont/Giles) to Oakland for Johnson.

r00b gets his setup man, and Beane gets his RH platoon bat for 1B, along with a young reliever, who, under Oakland's instruction, rises quickly to become the A's closer before the end of 2014.

So, the Phils get a 10MM setup man in Johnson, who's good but only pitches 60 innings.

Beane gets a 1B who gets 350 PA, hits 15-20 dingers and gets only base a ton, and even spot starts in LF, and a closer, all for less than $1MM on the year.

NOOOOO!

bap, r00b really baked the poodle as far as Kratz is concerned, no?

Wil Nieves, he of the career 60 OPS+, and
Brad Lincoln, he of the 1.5 HR/9 in the last two years.

These are examples of Amaro working around the edges with the deft touch he developed under Pat Gillick.

Lincoln was one of the guys the Phils were pretty interested when they moved Vic in '12.

Basically it is Nieves & Lincoln for Rasmussen & Kratz.

Phils basically add Lincoln in the mix to compete with Rosenberg, De Fratus, and possibly Aumont in spring training for a roster spot.

Call in a push and hopefully Lincoln doesn't behind hitters as much and have to throw his very straight 92-93 MPH fastball in too many hitter's counts.

Lincoln was a good move in theory...he at least has some upside as a reliever.

With Nieves in tow, it made no sense to keep Kratz. Getting Lincoln for him is an alright move, unless that minor leaguer included in the package amounts to something.

***Another "young" lefty.***

Lincoln is a RHP...he just bats LH for some reason.

I like the Lincoln deal, alot actually. Kratz is a guy who I didn't expect to stay with the club in 2014 anyway.

To turn that into a swingman reliever who has talent to have a chance to can contribute is a win in my book. Lincoln throws pretty hard with a good overhand curve. Stocking up on relievers like him is always a good idea, and hope a few turn out to have success.

So the Phils will have a 36 year old catcher backing up a 35 year old catcher?

Maybe a horst for valdez type that 'll help in 2014. Sorry about the left vs right mixup .

Lincoln deal was actually pretty good, as long as RAJ doesn't think he's found his late-inning righty to replace Adams. I fear he does. The deal would have been 10 times better if they had simply replaced Kratz with Rupp rather than signing a lousy, old backup catcher to take his place.

It is a AAA left handed reliever for a AAA right handed reliever.

ColonelTom: I agree re: Rupp, but no guarantee that Wil Nieves wins the backup job in spring training. Hell, the Nieves thing isn't even official yet.

He'll most likely compete with Rupp, and if Rupp clearly out-performs the Phils will either let him go or send him to AAA. Just catching depth.

Signing Webb and Wright would on paper make the bullpen much better than it entered last season.
Papelbon
Adams (provided he is healthy)
Bastardo
Webb
Wright
Martin
DeFratus (?)
Is better than the trash we ran out there at the start of 2013.
Sign Bailey and stash him away and you actually have the beginnings of some depth in the bullpen spots.
Of course you still have Mayberry and Frandsen clogging up roster spots but hey- progress in one area.

Kratz is one of the five guys I absolutely wanted off the roster. That they got anything of value for him is a miracle.

Thanks for that HR against Chapman, Erik, I enjoyed that.

FYI - Lincoln's scouting report from 7 years ago as a #4 overall pick looks pretty damn good.

What really bothers me is Salty, who is 5 years younger than Ruiz got less money the Ruiz did. I like Chooch of course, who doesn't? But after this one today Roob needs to go right now. I mean why choose Nieves over Kratz?

Nobody wanted Saltalamacchia until he signed.
Ellsbury is signing a 7 year deal and was another guy many here didn't want until he signed.
DPat is furiously circling names that he can bring up 3 years from now.

Does anyone know if there is Canadian Turkey Bacon? Or is it Turkey Canadian Bacon? Please let me know.

DPat - give Ruben a break, we know he is simply trying his best.

We need to entertain offers for Howard, his contract is bargain.

Iceman is spot on!

Def. disagree w/ Corey on Rupp. The Phillies have an annoying history of preferring to acquire guys like Nieves rather than letting younger players stick in MLB for awhile. Nothing like making a barely interesting team even less interesting.

Nieves might be a good catcher for our new Spanish speaking starting pitcher.

What...you think Christopher Dock didn't have a good Spanish program!?!

Fake "Awh" is posting again.

Shoot me now. Please.

DPat is the Master of the Alternate Universe of looking at contracts, signings and trades in a vaccum.

Excited that we were able to achieve a deeper catching dynamic now with Navarro/Thole/Kratz and AJ Jiminez up and coming. Don;t know what Rasmussen will become but he provides a young arm as insurance with the potential to develop in the next few years. If your interested in learning more about what this trade means for Toronto check this out: http://www.gcconnected.com/jays-get-more-help-grab-another-catcher-young-sp/

You're nice people in Toronto, but you just got Erik Kratz. Expressly not cause for excitement.

So there's no way to get Curtis Granderson without losing that draft pick?

Hey, why is the funny comment that was at the end of this post gone? That was good stuff.

I hear Roob is working on a deal to get both Griffey and Bonds and they wouldn't have to give up that much.

Wil Nieves was needed to help push the average age of the 25 man roster to even higher levels. Good move Roob! Maybe we can bring back Laynce Nix and Brian Schneider too for depth and intense spring training competition.

Brad Lincoln is some coveted commodity? By who? He's Mike Stutes. Why not try and dump that overpaid clown you have at the back of your bullpen instead? Ohh that's right...he's got one of those untradeable contracts you so cleverly dole out at the drop of a hat. So instead of making substantial moves to upgrade your club and get younger, you are forced to keep making these mickey-mouse moves for 3rd string catchers and middle-aged utility players.

Much as I like Kratz, this is actually a halfway decent move on paper. Kratz wasn't in the plans for 2014 and Lincoln has a lot more upside than Rasmussen. That said, given Lincoln's sub-par major league history, there's a better than 50-50 chance that this turns out to be a bust, just like practically every other RAJ bullpen acquisition.

Wasn't me @ 10:40 folks. Fake poster copied that post and the one below it. Those 2 posts were from the earlier thread.

Ice~ I have a problem with what RAJ has done simply because I believe he overpaid on Byrd & gave an extra year on Ruiz. Not saying they should've signed Salty. A point I was making earlier is that while Howard's contract limits the team, so do some others. Blame the GM for that, not the players. I know you understand. Some others do not. They mix apples and oranges.

Nieves is not the backup C I'd want based on age and poor defensive skills. I guess the trade for Lincoln is ok. Don't know much about him.

What we all do know however that unless RAJ has something up his sleeve, the team is status quo basically (marginally better?), and that doesn't get them anywhere. That's all. Not that I was implying they'd be a playoff team. And what I don't buy is the line "well if everyone plays like their capable of..... Well that works if your team is young. But the core is aging. So it's unlikely they'll produce the same as they did in their prime. And while at one time I believed this group deserved another shot, I'm wavering from that now.

Phils need bullpen help. Getting Lincoln for Kratz and Rasmussen is a move I can support, whether it pans out or not. Guy has borderline starter stuff and is of a type that can put together a solid season for you, especially with help from his battery mate. Picking up Nieves is shaky as I'd prefer a better defender but, they were going to get another catcher. They weren't going into next season without adding depth there. The third string guy will see a good share of the PT.

Ruben is a genius. A little pitching help and his lineup is set with a solid core of veterans locked up for a couple years and a chance to win every other game. He can now relax at the winter meetings and have a little fun. Maybe swap one of the remaining "free agents" on the roster, probably for bullpen help.

At least now if Ruben wishes to trade one of his core veterans he can negotiate from a more comfortable position. He can just listen to offers and smug-smile. I find it difficult to fathom that the totality of the inner core is satisfied with the increasing inertia of this ball and chain organization. I say Utley to the West Coast.

There are posters here who actually think Kratz is better than Nieves? My God.

This deal is far from earth-shaking, but Lincoln has the best stuff and best upside of any of the 3 players.

Rasmussen has very mediocre stuff, but has 4 pitches and, on the rare occasions he commands them within the strike zone, can be quite effective. He was a 27th rounder for a reason.

Lincoln's problem is also command and control, but his stuff is very good.

These are the kind of deals I wish Rube had been making all along.

the new Phillies battle cry: "Every Other Game !!!"

***There are posters here who actually think Kratz is better than Nieves? My God.***

It boggles the mind...when you look at the the two moves together (and they are definitely linked), it was actually a good move that improved the team on paper. Lincoln, like most relievers, is inconsistent but he's quite capable of having a solid year...especially now that he's back in the NL and Kratz is basically the same guy as Nieves but with a lower batting AVG.

***I hear Roob is working on a deal to get both Griffey and Bonds and they wouldn't have to give up that much***

Well played.

Look wunst Mr. Clout you dairsent make fun of Kratzie. We wilcom him.

i was about to say, i hope erik and sarah and the kids find a nice little anabaptist community in toronto.

There are posters here who actually think Kratz is better than Nieves? My God.
Look at Nieves Wp allowed and runners thrown out. Now do the same for Kratz.All Blers know HR are more important than BA.

Lincoln deal is meh. He is a serviceable, average reliever with little upside. Nieves is an upgrade offensively and worse defender than Kratz. While the rest of baseball was making significant moves, Ruben had his thumb up his a$$. I aam an advocate of signing Jimenez. As I've said in an earlier thread, he has straightened out his delivery and reverted back to the good numbers he had in Colorado. He's only 30 yrs old. Sign 2 of Webb, Wright, or Mujica. At least, on paper, there'd be some semblance of hope. This inactivity by Rube is unnerving, to say the least.

There's your creativity, you whiny wannabes. Just remember when you see the Lincoln/Nieves battery at work THAT WAS ALL ME!!

this is what i see for 2014:

revere - should improve on the average of last season.
rollins - should rebound, at least a bit.
utley - hopefully status quo
howard - has to rebound now that he's healthy
ruiz - a full year of speedy chooch. incentivized to make the wall of fame.
brown - a rested achilles should help
asche - who knows?
byrd - also wants to make the wall.

i'll be content to go to war with this team come april.

We at least got one guy under the age of 30, I'll take it.

Speaking of either bad luck or bad baseball evaluation...as was previously noted, Brad Lincoln was a former top pick (#4 overall in 2006)...here's the guys drafted right after him:

#5: Brendan Morrow
#7: Clayton Kershaw
#10: Tim Lincecum
#11: Max Scherzer

So, 3 Cy Young winners (5 CY total between them) in the first 11 picks (not to mention Evan Longoria at #3 and guys like Trevor Cahill and Justin Masterson in the 2nd round) and you go with Brad Lincoln over them.

Ouch.

Also, that 2006 first round was absolutely loaded with elite talent...you dont always see that.

I'm going to put that new battery down as a marginal improvement on Aumont/Kratz, and no further damage done. So kudos Rube.

If Marlon Byrd makes the Phillies Wall of Fame I think Schmidt and Carlton would put a hit out on David Montgomery.

It seems that in Rube's world acquiring a failed former top draft pick is almost as good as acquiring a seasoned vet who had a good season or two 5 years ago.

FWIW, I actually like this move...I dont often say that about something Rube does but Lincoln is a decent reliever and better than our internal options and Nieves for Kratz as backup catcher is pretty much a wash anyway.

We got a guy still young enough and with the raw stuff to maybe put together a really good year and even if he doesn't, his floor right now is "servicable middle reliever"...yeah, I know, finding a servicable middle reliever should be easy but it hasnt been for the Phillies and every guy they've tried internally has been atrocious.

Even if it doesnt work out, its a decent roll of the dice.

In the 2006 draft, Kershaw was the highest rated high school pitcher. Number 2 was Kyle Drabek, who slipped to the Phils because of off-field issues.

NEPP: I bet that Lincoln went higher due to cost.

NEPP: Welcome to the FO apologist club.

Your membership is at the door and we will be able to purchase food and drink supplies as soon as Monty tells us our budget.

See, Kratz lacked the versatility we try to impress upon the players here in Philly. Lincoln, though; he's versatile. He can both start and relieve. Because he's got some versatility. Like me.

Looks like Granderson is heading to the Mets for 4 years. No money details released yet. Going from Yankee Stadium to Madoff Field will have a huge impact on his numbers.

Yay! First deal of the off-season that doesn't instantly annoy me!

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