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Saturday, October 05, 2013


I'm unconvinced that Billmeyer's coaching was in any way insufficient -- & certainly his attitude cannot be criticized -- but it should be the manager's prerogative to choose his own guys. Fare thee well, Mick.

Great post finger

Is that a picture of Billmeyer or CAMERON RUPP?





You're all in, or you're all out.


Yawwwwwwwn. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Well, I guess r00b and the FOols have solved the problems that ail the Phillies.

In other news, given the Phillies' 2013 bullpen deficiencies, it's been reported on mlbtr that the Orioles do not intend to bring back K'ORod.... :)

Hey Allan, good to see you're allowed to use the internet again. Did they let you watch the '08 parade from prison?

It's time. It's bowe time.......


No talk that Robinson Canal and the Phillies have come into conversation? The story said that the Phillies were about third on the list in the Cano list. Let's talk about what that would mean for this team. Obviously Chase playing another position. As well as treating Cody for another player . But basically running out of any more money for the off-season.

Put Utley at 1B (assume Howard is finished) and Cano at 2B.

Put Utley in LF and Cano at 2B.

Neither one of these is ideal though and the amount of money it would cost to sign Cano would hamstring them in other areas leading to another horribly flawed club.

IE, if he's got the Phillies on his list its because his list is a list of "Big market clubs with cash" and it is meaningless.

Unless, of course, Cano could handle 3B which I dont believe he has the arm for (kinda why he's a 2B to begin with). Part of the reason he was moved from SS in the minors had to do with arm strength.

Its just not a good fit and it likely 100% a negotiating tactic for Cano and his agent.

The Cano ship sailed when they re-signed Utley. I was in favor of pursuing him before that.

I'm curious about this Robinson Canal guy, though, and if he can play right field.

Agreed, NEPP. Fantastic offensive player... but not a good fit, and most likely using the Phillies' name to drive up his asking price.

I liked what I heard about Billmeyer. Sounds like there wasn't anything not to like about him.

don't mind replacing coaches as long as the replacements are at least as good. I'm with GTown, though, as to wondering what Juan Samuel brings to the table?

Regarding the last thread topic, I've decided that one of the big questions next year is Mike Adams. If he's healthy (we have so many "if"s), then our 8th inning is set, and we'll have all those other pieces to shake out and see who's going to perform and who isn't. Diekman? Rosenberg? De Fratus? Stutes?

I didn't realize that Bastardo was arbitration-eligible.

I've liked the discussion the last few days about what the team can do to be competitive next year, and if it's even possible. I think there are four different paths that can be taken, all with varying degrees of likelihood:

1) Rube goes nuts and signs


Probability: 10%. Amaro knows his job is on the line this year, and he's gotten the dreaded 'vote of confidence' from Montgomery. He's obviously not going to sign all of these players, but I think there's more than just a faint chance he'll do something like this. This would lead to the team at least competing for a playoff spot next year, so I disagree with those that say it's impossible. It's just not likely.

2) Roll with what they have and sign a few cheap guys for depth (David DeJesus, etc) with the sole purpose of giving the young guys reps.

Probability: 70%. I think, despite the 'retooling' talk, Amaro does at least sort of recognize the situation the organization is in. Guys like Asche, Ruf, Hernandez, and the guys in the bullpen need to showcase themselves over a full season to give the front office an idea of what they have going forward. Chances are the team is not competitive and take a year to do something like this. If they do, I think they should deal Cliff Lee at the Winter Meetings to the highest bidder.

3) Get creative and sign ACTUAL low-risk/high-reward guys to push vets for playing time. Make one big splash like Tanaka to bolster the rotation. Use the low-risk/high-reward guys to push people like Asche/Hernandez/Ruf to the bench, or at the very least make them earn their playing time.

Probability: 19.9%. I would advocate doing this, because I don't think Asche, Ruf or Hernandez are players that you build a franchise around, as much as we all want them to be. I believe all of them can be useful in a part-time role.

The question is what signings could Amaro make to upgrade the roster without completely breaking the bank? I'd advocate a few things:

-Sign Corey Hart. A perfect fit, as many here have mentioned. Can be a starter in RF or moved to 1B if Howard goes down. Ruf can slide into Mayberry's role and platoon with Howard at 1st and basically be guaranteed 300 PAs or more.

-Sign David DeJesus and use him in CF. Move Revere to a 4th OF, which would upgrade the bench immediately. Obviously as I've said in the past, I think Revere can be a positive contributor in a starting role, but DeJesus is a better offensive player, and signing both DeJesus & Hart would give the team five legitimate OFs- six if you count Hernandez- three of which can play CF. Goodbye, Mayberry.

-Re-sign Chooch.

-Sign Tanaka. A safe splash to make, and he's not blocking anyone from playing time.

-Finally- and this is never going to happen- but I would look into signing Stephen Drew. This would enable them to either A) Dump Rollins' salary, or B) Push Rollins for PT at SS. If Rollins keeps his patient approach at the plate, teach Drew to play 3B in spring training and play both of them. If Rollins goes back to hacking, bench him and make sure his option doesn't vest.

Implementing all those moves would give them a lineup that could look like this:


With a bench of:


And a rotation of:


Another signing I'd make is someone like Villenueva, Capuano or Gorzelanny that can eat innings out of the bullpen, but also be a sixth starter for the team if Kendrick or Pettibone bomb. It's a valuable piece for a team to have- especially one that lacks both rotation and bullpen depth.

I think that roster stands a good chance of being competitive.

4) Trade every asset they have for Giancarlo Stanton.

Probability: 0.1%. Reckless and unrealistic, but it can't be ruled out as a possibility.

It's too warm to hibernate.
Am going to go out and forage.

You Comcast guys need to start running thread headers by awh before you post them.

Iceman: I'm kinda surprised you are relegating Revere to the bench

TTI- I like Revere a lot and I think they could be fine with him as a starter. I'd still start him against every LHP they face.

This team is starved for offense though, and DeJesus overall is a far better player against RHP. He represents an upgrade at a pretty minimal cost.

Also- and again, I think Revere could be a positive contributor as a starter- but his skill set makes him very valuable as a bench player.

-An actual defensive replacement (unlike Mayberry) that would be a real upgrade in any position in the OF for the late innings

-A speedster that can give them a stolen base threat off the bench when they need a run

-Can hit both RHP and LHP (and on a team stacked with lefties, that skill is valuable) so a manager couldn't negate him completely by bringing in another reliever (again, unlike Mayberry)

They could do a lot worse than having Revere as a sort of 4th/utility OF who saw action in every game even if he's not starting.

Another postseason RBI for Elmn Young on a sac fly. The announcer said 0-2 was the real chance to get Elmn out with a low pitch.

Phils Intel Communications:

Operation Eagle Eye failed. Immediate stop. Terminate Billmeyer and destroy all associated orders and equipment.

Eeesh not sure about the low risk high reward types. How often does Rube get this right? Perhaps I would take a chance on one of these types.

I'm not expecting it to happen, but I'd put the chance of a Stanton trade higher than 0.1. He seems to be the new "white whale" for RAJ, and he's the obvious difference maker who is believed to be available.

I can imagine a scenario where an ugly Rollins divorce from the Phils happens.

It was mighty coincidental that the phillies suffered a notible offensive swoon that coincided almost perfectly with the binocular incident.

1) Rube goes nuts and signs


Probability: 10%. Amaro knows his job is on the line this year, and he's gotten the dreaded 'vote of confidence' from Montgomery. He's obviously not going to sign all of these players

Do you actually think Amaro has anything whatsoever to do with this?

All such decisions for more than the past decade are and have been DAVID MONTGOMERY.

Amaro doesn't want to fight a war against Scott Boras anymore than Mike Arbuckle did when he went public with the fact he was forbidden to draft Mark Teixeira.

It's David Montgomery.

He is and has been your GM.

I'm hitting dingers and dickin minds

Sorry. Siri didn't understand Robinson Cano and I didn't proof read it.

I've rigorously praised Joe Maddon in the past, and I still do. He's a great manager.

But the Rays have an off day tomorrow, and are down 2 runs right now. Price has been getting hammered all day, has been getting no swings and misses, and has already given up 6 runs.

The Rays find themselves down 2 runs against the non-Koji part of the Sox bullpen. What in the world was Maddon thinking letting Price start the sixth inning?

I know he got through it, but seriously, the Rays have a deep and talented bullpen, and don't play again until Monday. Just bad managing.

Iceman, I liked your post about the Phillies options. The first option is very intriguing to me. Something like that might actually get me excited for next season.

The Phils are already committed at first, second, and short. the best that we can hope for is a platoon at first with Howard and Ruf.

Utley made 124 starts this season. I don't think we can expect more going forward. Hernandez could be an adequate backup at second in the 40 games that Utley doesn't start.

I would stick with Asche at the beginning of the season. Galvis can be the backup at both third and short.

The team needs to improve the rotation. Right now, it looks like Lee, Hamels and MAG have three of the five slots. For the other two slots, I would shoot for two of these three: Tanaka, Jimenez, and Josh Johnson. Of course, if the medical reports are not good, pass on Johnson.

There is uncertainty and risk in what I suggest for the rotation, but moves like these are necessary for the Phils to be competitive in 2014. I don't think the Phils will go in this direction.

In the OF, Beltran would be a good choice, assuming he is a non-comped FA. There are some good FA outfielders available, but I would not sign any that require compensation (The Phillies' second pick should be in the 40s. I would not be willing to give up this pick for a FA.). Corey Hart would also be good if the medical reports are OK.

If a young upgrade is available, I would consider trading Brown.

My outfield in 2014 would be Revere in center and either two new corners or Brown and a FA.

I would keep Chooch.


David Ortiz hit a HR off David Price?

But Ortiz is a LH BAT!


Just ask a PHANTARD


this looks like the Boston House of David.

" two of these three: Tanaka, Jimenez, and Josh Johnson"

MATT GARZA is far better than Josh Johnson. In fact Kyle Kendrick is far better than Josh Johnson. Josh is done.

BTW, you do know that Tanaka will probably cost $66 mil to win the bid to sign him. He's not only the best available pitcher he is also the most expensive.

The Yankees and Red Sox are on him. Tanaka can become a legit ACE.

The Phillies need that because even with Choo and a catching tandem of McCann and Chooch their lineup would basically stink. It would be just good enough to win with outstanding pitching.

Shane went to a much better place! He's doing well, too. I still miss him, but I'm happy for his success with the Red Sox.

I expected more out of the Rays. Thought they'd come back with Price on the mound today, like the Pirates did last night, to even up the series. Too bad. But they get to go home now, and they've been doing well with must-win games in the past few weeks. Not sure how much of a boost it is to play in Tampa Bay with the cowbells rather than cheering, but we'll see!

So AEC has a plan of create an all-star team basically. Fvcking brain surgeon this guy!

The RAYS stink.

I enjoy watching their low rent a$$ get reamed.


Hey, look! C.B. Buckner blew another call. Not as bad as the Jimenez touch, but still.

Free AEC:
For "low rent a$$", the Rays managed to win as many games this year as the vaunted Dodgers whom you constantly demand the Phils spend like. Given that the Rays have only a quarter of the payroll, it seems like they might just be onto something.

Nice job, genius. Feed the troll.

Not you, Juums...

What a crappy bunt.

The RAYS have never won anything

Neither has Billy Beane.

George Steinbrenner "was onto something".

SEVEN World Series trophies.

Eleven ALCS titles.

The Red Sox have won two WS in the last decade and I expect them to win their third this month.


"Feeding" Free AEC would give him some manner of feedback so as to encourage him to keep posting. No matter what I, or anyone else, say, he'll keep coming back with "something something FIVE FOR FIGHTING and something something $scammies".

And I concur with Gbrettfan. That was indeed a horrible bunt. But given how this game's been going, can't fault the A's for trying to play smallball.

I keep forgetting about MAG. That makes things a lot easier. Ditch Kendrick and save $6-7 million to upgrade the outfield.

Also, I kept Asche off the roster because I think they should trade him. He seems like a nice kid, but he isn't the type of player you build a franchise around, and he's got a guy storming behind him ready to play on the big club in 2015 (possibly sooner). I think they should look to deal him while they can get something of value for him. I don't think he serves the team much on the bench.

This is a terrifically pitched game. Kudos to the rookie Sonny Gray for going toe to toe with Verlander and acquitting himself splendidly.

With it looking like Verlander's out of the game, I daresay Gray's outpitched him. Which is doubly impressive.

Wow, a walkoff 1-0 win in the 9th! What a game!

And the walkoff hit came from the journeyman catcher who'd spent seven years toiling in the minors, whose heroic PA the last time he was up was probably the reason why Verlander's night ended after 7 IP. Hard to script it any better.

Because this is still a Phillies blog: Assuming the A's super-platoon bench is the next wave of the future, I wonder what impact it'll have on the DH-in-the-NL discussion. As the super-platoon bench can only really work in the AL (or at least work to its maximal efficacy), due to the traditional NL bench's pinch-hitting requirements.

Who would they get to play 3B then Iceman? Maybe i missed something. I think I want to see a lil more of this Franco kid to make sure he doesnt flame out. A la insert many prospects that do..Dunno say Matt Rizzotti...

@juums the NL will have the DH in a year or two. I'm not necessarily in favor of it and won't pout like a 5 year-old when it happens, but I think it's inevitable.

I can DH and play the OF. My vote is to tender me it only cost 1.7 Mill. Think im getting the hang of it now. Ive been taking pointers from dad.

Full season interleague play is here. The dhwill follow, perhaps as soon as the winter meetings.

Word is the Phils are bringing back 73 year old 'Irish' Mike Ryan to replace Billmeyer.

iceman: Aside from the "lets trade Asche for someone better than Asche" thought, I really don't see how moving him helps this team at all. Young cheap depth is what this team has been craving for years.

Not to get that stupid AEC jerkoff dumbass riled up, but a Tanaka signing would be awesome. If the Phils cared about winning, then the posting fee shouldn't even be a concern since it doesn't affect the luxury tax.

Darvish's AAV is under $10M, so I don't think Tanaka's will be much more than that. Darvish probably had a bit more prospect status than Tanaka does right now, but his MLB success has probably upped the price for Tanaka as a comparable. Either way, I doubt you'll need more than a $10M AAV to sign.

A nontender of KK (6.6M) almost wipes that out by itself, do you really wouldn't be hurting your overall offseason budget either.

Lore- obviously if they don't get someone like Stephen Drew, and have a vacancy at 3B, they might as well keep Asche.

The problem is that I don't think Asche will have much (if any) value after a season's worth of reps at this level. I also don't think he factors into the team's plans for the future (at least whenever they plan on being competitive again). So instead of bringing him off the bench, when they already have Galvis, I'd rather them trade him for whatever they can get for him- unless he brings a valuable skill to the table off the bench that I'm missing.

I hope I'm wrong and that he turns into a league average starter, but I wouldn't bet on it.

I think Asche's bat will play in the MLB. It might not be enough to stick a position like 3rd to warrant him as a building block, but it should be enough to keep him as viable bench piece - whether he's filling in for weeks, PH'ing, or platooning.

I expect him to be a 105-110 OPS+ hitter and rather soon. That's good enough to stick around, but probably not good enough to start at 3B since he won't be bringing any surplus of value with his glove to compensate.

I think he's the example of what this team needs to gravitating towards. Young cost controlled players who have potential without also carrying around glaring deficiencies/limits.

Ice~ I agree with your option with one exception. I believe a better RH bat than Hart needs to come in. If he's healthy though, he wouldn't be a bad option.

I think it's too soon to say how good Asche will be. I did read that Chase Utley likes the kid, which makes me optimistic for Asche's potential.

DPat- who would you suggest?

Much better games lately on the LDS front. Verlander is having a "What it feels like to pitch well for the Phillies" moment this morning.

Word on the street is that Ryan Braun may become available this winter....

The Yankees bought Babe Ruth for a staggering sum of cash in 1920.

Why didn't the PHILLIES buy The Babe?

He was a LH BAT!


Does any giving player necessarily have to be "someone to build around" to be kept?

If somebody trades for Ryan Braun this winter, it will be a real test of whether there's no such thing as bad publicity. As between his PED usage, the various disreputable things Braun did in fighting the consequences of said PED usage, and the gargantuan sum still owed to him for the next seven seasons, there'll be plenty to grouse about.

Though Braun really is the perfect fit for the Phillies: He's a player just about ready to start declining, who's owed a king's ransom for past performance through the period of time when just about everybody's playing ability deteriorates. He'd be a perfect extension target for RAJ, except that the Brewers already took the fun out of that by beating him to it.

What do you think Braun will cost? Poor reputation, possible downturn in numbers, etc. Or just maybe he plays just as good and trading Biddle and Co would be worth it.

Word on the street is that Ryan Braun may become available this winter ....

I can't imagine why. Of course acquiring Braun might have been interesting when D. Young was still on the team. Both are sh*theels, albeit for different reasons. Then there's the whole "What kind of player will Braun be w/out the the PEDs?" issue. Pass.

Braun should cost a bucket of golfballs, if you're taking on all of the salary. He's owed at least $102MM through 2021, or $118MM if the 2021 option is exercised. As the primary motive for the Brewers making such a move would be either to get rid of Braun's baggage (in which case they just want him gone and can't drive a hard bargain) or as a salary dump (in which case they won't be willing to eat some of the salary to get prospects). Or, most likely, all of the above.

Braun is a huge risk, given the amount of money he's owed going forward. Any deal that involves Biddle is one in which the Brewers will have made out like bandits.

I wouldn't trade Michael Martinez for Ryan Braun.

You know, I was actually just thinking that's what it would take to do a Braun trade: A journeyman OF like Mayberry or Susdorf whom the Brewers could plug into RF immediately and whatever pieces of organizational dreck were forced upon the Brewers as the price of taking on all of Braun's contract.

Something like $_journeyman_OF, Mini-Mart, and Aumont. The Brewers even get a guy with a titanic amount of upside in Aumont. (That he'll never reach because his best case scenario is Carlos Marmol, but still.)

b_a_p: I wouldn't trade Martinez at all. I'd outright release him, which is what every other team in baseball would have done long ago.

Say the choice is between Braun and Stanton. In one case you give up little value in prospects but take on a huge salary. In the other, you give up a king's ransom (still paying the guy a lot once he reaches arbitration, though not as much as option 1).

Just a hypothetical.... I would most likely choose neither of the above... But if we're talking about adding a true impact, MVP caliber RH bat, there are only so many options. Option C is a 7-10 year contract at $20-25m per in Cano.

PEDs affect players differently. I remember Canseco saying he never even would have made MLB without PEDs. Contrast that with other guys like Ortiz who seem to be able to play well without them.

But we don't know what we'll get from a PED-free Braun. He could still be very good, or he could be another _elm_n and put up that kind of slash line.

Braun, IMHO is too much of a risk.

That was the baseball evaluation of Braun.

On a personal level, I would never want to root for that guy in a Phillies' uniform.

Glanville, the problem with CAno is that he has pretty significant L/R splits - over .100 OPS.

Granted, he's still above average against LHP, but how well would he do as he ages?

Keep in mind even Ryan Howard used to be good against LHP.

BTW, Cano wants 10 years and $305MM, so 20-25 won't get it done.

Great player, but no thanks at that price, because on THIS team he's not a difference maker - meaning he wouldn't be the difference.



He won't get 300m, or even close to it. That number is his agency floating big numbers to set the bar high. Just like Bourne asking for 7 years last year. I will bet he goes for Prince Fielder $/years, or thereabouts.







Just because Cano wants 10yr/$305MM doesn't mean he's going to get anywhere close to that. There're all of two teams in MLB at present with the resources and willingness to spend that kind of money, and one of them's already said they want nothing to do with the Cano sweepstakes. (While the other's thinking in the 7yr/$140-$150MM range.) He's going to command a king's ransom, but he won't be breaking A-Rod's record for the largest contract ever signed.

That title will likely go to Mike Trout, if he elects to pursue free agency immediately after his arbitration years. Which I dread will happen, because all of the Phils' odious megacontracts will finally be off the books by the time that happens. (Assuming, of course, no new odious megacontracts between now and then.) And given this ownership group, Mike Trout's just the kind of player who'd provoke the perfect storm of stupidity required to hand any player a 10yr/$300MM+ contract.



SHIN-SOO CHOO 112 walks



Boras says no talking to the Phillies until 30-years war is over. Sorry.

Hrrm. So, the Pirates have drawn first blood against the Cardinals. On the one hand, the Pirates play in Pittsburgh, which I'm fairly certain means that as a Philadelphia sports fan it's my job to deride and distrust them. On the other, they're beating on the Cardinals, a team that it's the job of any good Phillies fan to detest.

Is there any way that they can both lose today? If not...go Bucs!

Juums, being on record as wanting a Bucs/A's WS, I gotta go with the Bucs.

Too bad the Phillies never had an OF like Marlon Byrd... oh, wait...

Juums- for some reason, I consider Pirates and Steelers fans separate entities (though there is probably much overlap). Pirates fans have been through the seven circles of hell in the last 25 years and deserve a winner. I'm rooting for them. Plus, all of the other options in the NL are awful.

Steelers fans, on the other hand, are a loathsome bunch of cretins that deserve all the misery they get. When Bane imploded Heinz Field in TDKR, I stood up and applauded.

"Steelers fans, on the other hand, are a loathsome bunch of cretins that deserve all the misery they get."


I suspect I shall soon consider Pirates fans kindred spirits, as there's an ominous dread in the back of my mind that the Phils are headed for that kind of painful interregnum. Hopeful the Phils can get lucky enough to save themselves from...themselves.

Speaking of the mess in the outfield, though: Buster Olney apparently expects the A's to "proactively" seek a trade of Yoenis Cespedes. Given his contract situation and their ability to absorb it all, the Phils should have the pieces to shake him loose if he becomes available. The question is, would it be worth the cost in prospects? Cespedes doesn't walk a lot, so when the bat has a down year, you're looking at his impressive .294 OBP from 2013. And the Phils desperately need a plus-defending RF: Cespedes is not that man. True, as he's a plus-defending LF (5.8 UZR/150 in 1,270 IP in LF) he'd still improve the outfield on-net, even with shifting Brown to RF. But we'd likely be running a very bad defender out there every day in RF.

awh, I, like you, am really hoping for a Pirates/Athletics World Series. It would get pitiful ratings, but WGAS.

I always wondered when the next A's sell off happens what the Phillies could get.

I love the crowds in Pittsburgh this postseason.

GTBrett, me too. Reminds me of the Zen during 2008 - 2009.

I could be way off base, but I'm starting to get the feeling that Free AEC wants us to sign


Hey Mikkke, does your parole officer know you are back to your old tricks?

I just searched for arb projections because I wanted to see what Bastardo & Revere would make next year, as well as potentially Lannan. Imagine my surprise when I saw that Bernadina ($1.3 mil) is projected to make less than Mayberry ($1.7 mil).

I was surprised by this because GTown_Dave has been saying for months that Bernadina is going to be more expensive than Mayberry and, since I apparently don't practice what I preach, I actually believed what he was saying. Just another example of how when he states something authoritatively, you should assume that exactly the opposite of what he's saying is true.

What a stupid play by McCutcheon. Damn.







What the hell was McCutcheon doing, running into an out like that?

BAP, where are you coming up with that far-flung theory?

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