Part of CSNPhilly.com


« Nats hang on to playoff hopes in win over Phillies | Main | Halladay scrapes and claws, but Phillies lose late »

Wednesday, September 04, 2013

Comments

Rollins listed as Questionable for tonight. Unsure why. DOM and Harper as doubtful.

Phillies 3B (fading)prospect Mitch Walding breaks ribs while getting off clubhouse couch.

Minor detail, but the clubhouse couch was located on the top of a mountain. He didn't know.

"Rollins listed as Questionable for tonight. Unsure why. DOM and Harper as doubtful."

11 other guys listed as "Awful."

1980 JPPL's Charlie Manuel: .325/.400/.673 with 48 HR and 129 RBI.

From the last thread (more or less):
In light of the on-going RF experiment with Darin Ruf, I've been pondering a great heresy: Do you try selling high on him this off-season? Assume he finishes the season with the line he has as of today: .250/.345/.500, on track for 35 HR and 186 K's with a 10% walk rate over a 600 PA season. While next year he'll be 27-28, he's making the league minimum for the next two seasons and can safely be jettisoned when he becomes arb-eligible due to his age. The FA market this coming off-season will also be fairly light on mashing 1B/DH-types, as well. So a cost-controlled 1B/LF/DH-type should certainly gain some interest if shopped, especially given the dreck that teams with good farms -- e.g. the A's and Orioles -- ran out there to DH this past season.

As big a fan as I am of Ruf, I just can't help but keep thinking that moving him is the best option, unless they intend to run him out there everyday at 1B. As the club can only afford to carry one passable-at-LF outfielder, and for the foreseeable future his name will be Dom Brown. Having another Delmon Young-caliber defensive OF -- which, mercifully, Ruf isn't as bad as though he's not that removed from -- is unacceptable.

"Halladay pitched very well in his return vs. Arizona..."

Must depend on what the meaning of the word "well" is.

Speaking of Halladay, here's a repost:

"Since 1916, only nine starting pitchers have struck out nine batters (or more) in four or fewer innings." This does not sound correct to me, but I don't know how to check it out.

That's nine separate occasions (including Randy Johnson four times) when pitchers probably had nine Ks through four innings, or six pitchers if Johnson is counted only once. Adding Martin and Halladay, that's 11 occasions and eight pitchers found with only partial research.

Does someone have a definitive answer?
Posted by: derekcarstairs | Tuesday, September 03, 2013 at 07:15 PM

Depending on what the meaning of the word "definitive" is, Mini hazards the guess that the reference is to games where a pitcher lasted only 4 or fewer innings. It's rare to have stuff good enough to strike out 9 guys in 4 or fewer innings and bad enough to last no more than 4 innings in the same game but the Phils have pulled it off twice this season.

Admirable versatility.

Juums: I would not.

Howard is probably going to just get hurt all over again, so there will be an opening at 1B. And even if he doesn't, he will still be getting some "rest" vs LHP a lot of the time.

DOM will be back in RF, and his offense/arm will need to account for his lack of glovework. If it doesn't, then that's a separate problem, not one you should lump against Ruf. As far as health, it doesn't look like he's going to be breaking Ripken's record anytime either.

And from what I can foresee, the starting LF is either Ruf's job already or going to be occupied by a risk candidate who will have his own set of questions, like a Corey Hart/Nelson Cruz.

I think that's plenty of opportunity for Ruf to play next year. This team is starved for talent. If Ruf can hit, then he's as important to the Phillies as any other team.


and obviously I'm not saying Ruf is untouchable, no one is one this team. I just doubt that if Ruf has value, it'd be used better elsewhere than here - so i don't see how we'd win a trade.

Re: Michael Martinez...

His career OPS+ of 36 is tied for 8th all time worst offensive players.

In the top 10, 6 are catchers. And the number one, worst offensive player of all time? Or old friend Jon Vukovich. who had a career 20 OPS+ and lived with his utility glove in his .607 PA he recorded a slash line:
.161/.203/.222/.425

I have no doubts that if Mini Mart were to get to 600 pa he would eclipse Vuk.

The Mendoza line (who is #25 on the list) should really be .500 OPS. There have been 30 players with min 370 PA who have recorded less than .500 OPS. Only ONE player had less than .400!!!!! A Brooklyn Superbas/Dodgers catcher from the early 20th Century who had 3229 PA with an OPS of .395

http://bbref.com/pi/shareit/bYTAO

Which is more than fair, Lorecore. As went unsaid in my initial supposition, he'd have to bring back enough to justify trading him in the first place. Which I'm not even sure could be done, because it's not really clear what the team needs that can't be addressed in FA.

That also assumes Ruf's bat remains for-real: He's been in a two-week funk and it's unclear whether it's because the book's out on him or because the BABIP Gods dislike him. The logic of moving him dictates that he put up a 130 OPS+ or better, as that kind of package that's also making the league minimum might should be enough to shake something loose to make it worth the trade. If not...well, if not, he's still a guy who'll work the count and take the walk, which is something the ball club desperately needs.

i agree, lorecore.

@derek/mini -- according to the b-r play index,
its true... and it happened 4 time this year. Once by Gio, twice by Phillies...

http://bbref.com/pi/shareit/5Qpxa

Also on the list Hideo Nomo, Bobby Witt, Jim Beattie, David Cone and Scott Kazmir

> 1980 JPPL's Charlie Manuel: .325/.400/.673 with 48 HR and 129 RBI.
> Posted by: LorecorE

And, I was chided yesterday for questioning the competitiveness of Japanese baseball.

"Halladay toes the slab as Phils finish Nats series"

Yeah, but which slab? Mound or Morgue?

Not that Ruf's last 2 weeks haven't been disconcerting, but I wish the Phillies had more players who would hit at a 47 HR pace during a "funk".

Scott Mathieson-san since moving to Japan:

2012: 42.0 IP, 1.71 ERA, 0.976 WHIP, 4.36 K/BB
2013: 52.1 IP, 1.03 ERA, 0.955 WHIP, 4.00 K/BB

Juumms - I would certainly look to move him. Ruf strikes me as one of those guys who is going to really struggle by the time he is 31-32.

Really should be a 1B/DH in the AL somewhere. Phils will never look to trade him if though especially if he has another productive year next year from a power prospective.

That would be nice, wouldn't it, Cyclic? Which is why at least part the problem is BABIP. If the only way you're getting a hit is if the ball's leaving the yard, then it's unfortunate, but sooner or later stuff will start falling in.

I suppose the worst case scenario is that Ruf ends up comparable to Adam Dunn. ...of White Sox vintage. There's certainly value there, but not as much you'd want given how promising he started.

I was listening on the radio at the time, but apparently he crushed the ball last night, right before Asche's HR, but the wind kept it in the yard.

Cyclic: He did. I couldn't believe it didn't go out. Just hit it to the wrong park of the yard, is all. Asche's HR wasn't hit nearly so well, but it was hit where the wind wasn't an obstruction.

Whether he's a 1B, DH, LF, or RF is irrelevant. The Phillies have shown this season that you need exactly 0 experience to play a position at the big league level. We might see Ruf at 3B before this season is out.

Preacher: It's an organizational philosophy. After all, two of the past three GMs had zero experience in scouting or player development before becoming Assistant GM, then GM.

"Lefty Mike Zagurski has opted out of his contract with the Athletics, MLBTR has learned."


Officially the last time the words "Mike Zagurski" and "Athletic" (adjective or proper noun) will appear in one sentence.

***After all, two of the past three GMs had zero experience in scouting or player development before becoming Assistant GM, then GM.***

That's up there with the people that go buy a restaurant because they like to eat...I mean, how hard could it be to run one, right?

A Brooklyn Superbas/Dodgers catcher from the early 20th Century who had 3229 PA with an OPS of .395

The infamous Bill Bergen, no doubt.

Juumms - I would certainly look to move him. Ruf strikes me as one of those guys who is going to really struggle by the time he is 31-32.

If you knew that Ruf was going to have 4 good years, wouldn't you want to get those years from him? Especially since you are going to need talents like his for the near term future?

"Scott Mathieson-san since moving to Japan:

2012: 42.0 IP, 1.71 ERA, 0.976 WHIP, 4.36 K/BB
2013: 52.1 IP, 1.03 ERA, 0.955 WHIP, 4.00 K/BB"

Counterpoint to the Mathieson/Dice-K/Cholly posts: Hiroki Kuroda's Japanese numbers were absolutely nothing to write home about, and he has been a very solid No. 2 starter in the states (even a borderline ace this year). Lesson: it's pretty tough to draw conclusions based solely on Japanese League numbers.

@derek/mini -- according to the b-r play index,
its true... and it happened 4 time this year. Once by Gio, twice by Phillies...

http://bbref.com/pi/shareit/5Qpxa

Also on the list Hideo Nomo, Bobby Witt, Jim Beattie, David Cone and Scott Kazmir

Posted by: HammRadio | Wednesday, September 04, 2013 at 01:47 PM

Nice piece of analysis, Hamm. Halladay holds the all-time record with only 3 1/3 IP to get his 9 Ks. In 2011 KC's Duffy also had 9 Ks in his first 10 outs but, sadly for him record-wise, went 3 2/3 by @derek/mini -- according to the b-r play index,
its true... and it happened 4 time this year. Once by Gio, twice by Phillies...

http://bbref.com/pi/shareit/5Qpxa

Also on the list Hideo Nomo, Bobby Witt, Jim Beattie, David Cone and Scott Kazmir

Posted by: HammRadio | Wednesday, September 04, 2013 at 01:47 PM

Nice piece of analysis, Hamm.

On this list, Halladay holds the record -- only 3 1/3 IP to get his 9 Ks. In 2011, KC's Duffy also got 9 Ks in his first 10 outs but followed his 9th K with a groundout before getting the hook.

Sorry about the double post -- all jacked up after getting a ribbie last night.

Japanese baseballs have also gone through some changes over the years, so as far as Charlie's line in 1980, it's not really fair to put him in the context of today's players.

> Officially the last time the words "Mike Zagurski" and "Athletic" (adjective or
> proper noun) will appear in one sentence.
> Posted by: Sad Guy

I think the writers at MLBTR have a sense of humor. Check out this headline from last month:

Mike Zagurski Exercises Opt-Out Clause
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/08/mike-zagurski-exercises-opt-out-clause.html

"Mike Zagurski Exercises". Too funny.

Hernandez - CF
Rollins - SS
Utley - 2B
Ruiz - C
Ruf - 1B
Asche - 3B
Mayberry - LF
Bernadina - RF
Halladay - P

Mayberry, Hernandez, Bernadina is about as "2013 Phillies" an outfield as you could possibly dream up.

> Lesson: it's pretty tough to draw conclusions based solely on Japanese League
> numbers.

My point exactly, which is why I wouldn't want the Phillies giving some ridiculous contract (plus posting fee) to the lastest big name coming out of Japan (who is actually viewed as a notch below Darvish and Dice-K) based on his stats from Japan.

If adjusting your athletic supporter/cup after every pitch counts as exercise, Zagurski is all over it. There's that word again - athletic.

Ruf has very little trade value, which is why he won't be traded.

People always advocate we trade guys like Ruf (or his lesser predecessors Matt Rizzotti, Jeremy Slayden, etc.) to an AL team. That ignores the fact that almost every team in the league has their own guys like Ruf: Older "prospects" who do nothing but hit. They're a dime a dozen. There's no value there.

If Ruf had any trade value, the Phils would've traded him already. They're better off just keeping him at this point and hoping he just gives them a couple seasons of a good bat, which they desperately need.

Lower AB/HR in 2014:

Ruf or Howard?

I would say, who will hit more HR overall, but that might depend on who has more PA.

Athletics soothsayers select elephant mascot in honor of their future reliever Mike Zagurski

How many big, big stars from Japan have really been worth the pricetag?

Ichiro and Darvish (so far) have been the only two really worth a massive posting fee. Dice-K was a fairly large blunder by the BoSox and lots of other guys failed utterly too. There have been a good number of mid-range guys like Kuroda and Matsui that have been solid as well obviously but with the big ticket ones, its been a roll of the dice.

NEPP: Ryu on the Dodgers is pretty good. Iwakuma on the Mariners so far too.

Just like in any player evaluation, you'll get hits and misses. I mean, look at the success rate of signing MLB free agents who have major-league track records to go on. It's not all that high.

It looks to me like MLB teams are getting slightly better at Japanese scouting, though. Seems the successes are starting to become more common.

For what it's worth, Ryu is Korean.

At this point, I feel bad for Morgan:

Assistant GM Benny Looper said Morgan was scheduled to be examined by team doctors this week.

“Hopefully with rest and rehab he’ll be fine,” Looper said.

So career over then?

***Just like in any player evaluation, you'll get hits and misses. I mean, look at the success rate of signing MLB free agents who have major-league track records to go on. It's not all that high***

The risk is a bit higher because of a couple things (especially with pitching)

1. Different size baseball in Japan...it's slightly smaller.

2. Posting fee ups the overall cost/risk as seen in the fees for Darvish and DiceK.

3. Harder to make comps as the level of play is different than the Majors...at least with an MLB FA, you have a good sample size to work with.

Sarah Baicker: "Sad thing: There is a box full of (possibly) hundreds of "buy one, get one" Phillies tickets to games through September on the desk at CSN."

Free ticket w/ the purchase of a pack of Phillies Franks in 3, 2, 1 ...

I wonder if the Phillies had put in a waiver claim on Daniel Bard and were beat out by the Cubbies. He would've been the perfect type of reclamation project for the bullpen.

On the Ruf discussion: I think you need to keep him around for next year because there is a good chance Howard could get hurt again and it'd be nice to have a right handed thumper to put there if needed.

What I'd do would be to sign Corey Hart, move Ruf to the Mayberry role, tell Mayberry to go pound sand and avoid any nearby walls.

Then I'd figure out how to get a good, cheap defensive center fielder as my 5th guy and roll with that.

***Then I'd figure out how to get a good, cheap defensive center fielder as my 5th guy and roll with that.***

Why bother? We all know that Mini Mart will still be around...or his sidekick Cesar "Mini" Hernandez.

Masahiro Tanaka is seen to be costing somewhere between Ryu (6/$62M) and Darvish (6/$110M), probably closer to Darvish with all the TV money coming in.

I can't wait for the Dollar Dog Night - Bark at the Park double promo.

Here's an idea...


MLB scouts have also been told to expect Team Japan center fielder Yoshio Itoi to be posted next winter. Itoi is a 31-year-old who has led the Pacific League in on-base percentage two straight years (.411 and .404). He had a 1.079 OPS through two rounds of the WBC.

"He's a good all-around outfielder," the scout said. "He can run. He can throw. He can play all three outfield spots."

The scout said Itoi is a better player than Norichika Aoki, the Japanese outfielder who joined the Brewers last year.

Why not take a run at him?

Matt Gelb: "The Phillies used 18 players last night. Eleven of them played for triple-A Lehigh Valley in 2013."

r00b ought to have skipped everything he said at the See Ya, Charlie presser & gone w/ "Most of the team is more used to being managed by Ryne Sandberg now, anyway."

NEPP: Honestly..if he is adequate I'd have no problem with Cesar Hernandez here as the 5th outfielder/IF backup.

Jack: "Ruf has very little trade value, which is why he won't be traded."

100% correct.

GTown: So what if 11 Phillies played for the Iron Pigs this season? The Iron Pigs are really goo....oh, wait. Nevermind.

" Dice-K was a fairly large blunder by the BoSox..."

the only positive were his first two years, 108 ERA+ and 160 ERA+, and they did win the WS his first year when he ate 200 innings, but overall, the contract has to rank up there in the echelons of one of the worst ever. ($100MM+)

Jack and clout are wrong. DPat's source told me that the Rockies were interested in moving Jhoulys Chacin for Ruf - straight up.

GTown: "r00b ought to have skipped everything he said at the See Ya, Charlie presser &..."


r00b ought to have skipped everything he said at the See Ya, Charlie presser & handed in his resignation.

There, fixed it.

"Why not take a run at him?"

Because he draws a huge number of wasteful walks and has never driven in more than 64 runs.

I like that in the Trade Ruf scenario Juums brings up, MG is most concerned about Ruf's skills decreasing 4 to 5 years from now as being a primary concern.

Given Ruben's favoring of Production™ over walking for hitters, I wonder if he encourages pitchers to walk more batters instead of allowing them to produce. It would explain a lot.

re: "Asche didn't hit his ball as hard as Ruf"

Wheels/Tmac said that on the broadcast, mainly because they got all giddy about a flyout, but didn't even realize a HR until it landed into the stands.

Asche's HR was roped. It was 104.3mph off the bat, which is a full mph faster than the average MLB HR this season. Don't know where to find hit f/x numbers for non HRs, but I doubt his was much harder than 104.3 mph.

Jack is right about Ruf and he will only have value if he puts decent power numbers over the course of a season.

As for Ruf, I still think his best comp is Daubach. Useful player as a DH and hitting RHP but he was done really as a useful player by 31.

Kind of what I think Ruf will end up being too.

ESPN Insider ran a piece called "Future Power Rankings" (subscription required):

http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/9612015/mlb-future-power-rankings-2013-update

The Phils ranked 25th out of 30 teams, with a comment that "[t]his is what happens when you refuse to rebuild."

For what it's worth, Keith Law had this to say about RHP Severino Gonzalez:

"Severino Gonzalez had a very strong second half at high Class A Clearwater, showing above-average command and feel for two off-speed pitches, projecting as a fourth starter; the righty's ceiling is limited by his slight build and tendency to give up fly balls."

""[t]his is what happens when you refuse to rebuild."

And as the Utley signing shows, it's going to get worse before it gets better. Rebuilding is not something Rube has any clue about.

Hahaha. Who is Utley blocking? Hernandez? Galvis? Who should they be spending the Utley money on?

NEPP: "The risk is a bit higher because of a couple things (especially with pitching)"

Except what I'm saying is that it seems like the risk isn't really higher. Teams are actually starting to get good value out of a lot of Japanese and Asian signings (Ryu, Iwakuma, Kuroda, Aoki, and Darvish have all been signed in the last couple of years and are all very good players).

All those things you list may be true, but empirically, I find it hard to believe the risk really is any higher than signing, say, Josh Hamilton or Albert Pujols or Ryan Howard or a whole host of others. Every FA signing is a risk. I agree that 10 years ago it seemed like the risk was much higher for for Asian pro players, but honestly, the market seems to have figured out how to accurately assess these guys.

To be fair, the Olney quote goes on, "Of course, it's hard to blame the Phillies for wanting to hang on to the core of players that brought them the greatest run of success in franchise history."

They give the Phils 5 points out of a possible 30 in the "management" category. Only two teams scored lower in that category, the Rockies and the White Sox.

I used to be excited on days when Halladay was lined up to pitch.

Now I dread it.

The problem, rocket scientist, is that the farm is barren. A rebuild would have included trading Utley for a prospect.

I suppose the intent of my thought re: trading Ruf was more, "if the opportunity presented itself, should Ruf be flipped for something useful?" versus "he should be moved to an AL team this off-season!" in terms of a starting point for a discussion. (Notwithstanding my concerns about the dangers of a potentially brutal defense outfield next season.) If there's no trade value there, there's nothing more to really say: While I question whether pure-bat guys of Ruf's caliber really are a dime-a-dozen, but the point is conceded that his skill-set is not exactly rare. I certainly don't have any qualms about paying a man with a 10% walk rate and plus raw power the league minimum for two more years.

Daubach is certainly an interesting comp. In five years of regular playing time, Daubach posted 4.8 fWAR. If over the next five seasons Ruf could produce at least~5 fWAR, at $4.5MM/WAR, you're looking at $22.5MM in value. As a no-glove masher, it strikes me that you'd end up with surplus value even through his arb years, even without figuring in the time-cost of money with regard to the surplus value he'd generate while making the league minimum.

How good of a prospect would a 2-month Utley rental get back?

Presumably someone at least as good as the 2 month Vic rental got back. You have to start somewhere.

The problem is that for Ruf to produce 1-2 WAR, he needs to do it at 1B, where he's best defensively (though best is a relative term). His defense in the OF will be bad enough that he's essentially not going to provide any overall value, unless he suddenly becomes Chris Davis. Even at 1B, it would still help if he hit better than he has sofar. His defense and baserunning have been bad enough so far this year that he has only been worth 0.5 WAR, despite a pretty valuable bat.

The best thing they could do is just platoon Howard and Ruf, straight up. If they don't, they'll be hurting the team when they play Howard at 1B against a lefty and Ruf in the OF. Which is of course exactly what I think they'll do.

I know it would probably make you feel better if they just dumped everyone for whatever they could get because, to you, that feels like a rebuild. But I'm not sure, in reality, that course of action automatically puts the franchise in a better position.

Utley's incentive-laden deal is certainly no hindrance to the short or long term prospects of the team. You have to start somewhere.

"Utley's incentive-laden deal is certainly no hindrance to the short or long term prospects of the team. You have to start somewhere."

Are you sure about that? Because it certainly looks to me like they're converting a plus defensive second baseman in Cesar Hernandez to another position and/or a utility spot because they have Utley at second.

Speaking of Cesar Hernandez, why is he playing CF?

Didn't we just trade for a 25-year old CF under team control for the next few season?

Now I don't know if Cesar Hernandez is capable of being a good starter at 2B for a championship team. I certainly have my doubts.

But if I were actually rebuilding, instead of the sad charade the Phillies are putting on, I would sure try and find out.

Jack-- I think TTI is right. They may see him as a Mini-Mart type 5th OF / utility guy. Isn't that pretty much his best case scenario anyway?

Cyclic: Well, I mean, if you want to make him into that, that's what he'll become.

But if you were rebuilding, you might see a guy who hit .309/.375 at AAA this season at age 23 and who scouts agree is a good defensive second baseman.

I would certainly want to find out if that guy could develop into his best-case scenario and turn into a positive contributor as an everyday 2nd baseman (hitting, say .300/.350/.400 with some steals and good defense--mid-career Placido Polanco).

If you were actually rebuilding, you'd give young guys a chance at being the best players they might end up being, until something better came along or until they clearly failed. But if you're doing what the Phillies are doing, you never give the guy a chance to develop into his best-case. They're already shoehorning him into being a utility guy, so that's what he'll be.

Because we definitely need more of those.

If Hernandez is a decent hitter and can back up 2B and CF credibly, we might have - *gasp* - depth at two positions where depth has been sorely lacking in recent years.

Jack, that's incredibly wishful thinking on Hernandez. I don't recall seeing any scouting report that was anywhere near as bullish as you are on his ceiling. Besides, if he's that good, he'll likely play himself into a larger role. I don't see depth on the big-league roster as a problem. It's a feature, not a bug.

Yeah, but he can always do that. If he doesn't work out as a starter, then he becomes your depth.

I'm not interested in finding capable backups for the 2014 Phillies. I'm interested in finding out who can be a significant contributor to the next winning Phillies core. It's almost surely not Chase Utley. I doubt it's Cesar Hernandez, but I would like to find out. Worst-case scenario, he can't handle playing everyday, and *gasp*, he becomes a utility guy, which is what you all apparently want. But at least you gave him the chance to be something more.

ColTom-- I haven't followed the minors very well but your 637 post is exactly what I was thinking with regard to Hernandez.

ColonelTom: It may be wishful thinking, but so is thinking that Chase Utley is going to be part of a winning team here going forward. So is thinking that Cliff Lee isn't going to decline. So is thinking that we're just a couple backups and a middle reliever away from contending next year.

I don't think Cesar is that good. Most likely he's not. But I'm saying there's a more than de minimis chance he could be. And the Phillies right now should be in the business of giving guys those chances. Because it's not like they've got much else going for them.

"Worst-case scenario, he can't handle playing everyday, and *gasp*, he becomes a utility guy"

You're a way more optimistic person than I ever thought if you think that's his worst case scenario.

Ok, worst-case scenario he sucks and is never a major-leaguer again.

Who cares? If that's the case, he's that way whether you play him at 2B or CF or wherever.

My whole point is that if you have young guys with a chance to be good, the Phillies are at the point where they need to be finding that out. Sure, most of them probably aren't that good, but a) the list of young guys with a chance to be good isn't very long for this team, and b) at least you found out. What did you lose? 95 games instead of 90? Oh no.

"They give the Phils 5 points out of a possible 30 in the "management" category."

So we're not the only ones to notice that this franchise is being run into the ground.

Nat BLer must be highly frustrated. That's a talented team over there not getting it done.

I'd rather watch Ethan Martin pitch.

Bless his heart, Doc's making it really hard for Rube to give him that multi-year extension.

Gotta feel badly for Doc. He wants so much to do well. It's almost uncomfortable to watch.

This is extremely sad

Complete difference between resigning Utley to the deal the did than not say trying to trade Lee.

Trading Lee though with the money he is owed and a pretty extensive no trade clause.

Just imagine how much worse it would be if was over 80 degrees. At least Doc is relatively cool.

Why is Halladay pitching?

This is ridiculous. He's either still not right, or just a terrible pitcher now, or both. No matter how you slice it, he shouldn't be pitching out there.

Anyone think we should still bring Doc back?

Or should we just call the knacker now to come pick him up?

I don't know how to look something like this up, but are hitters chasing fewer pitches outside the zone against Halladay in the last couple of years because they can tell Doc's not Doc?

Doc may throw his hundred pitches in this inning.

These are just rehab starts for Doc, remember? He's fine...

Thing is there will still be people this offseason who say "man, if Howard comes back healthy, and we re-sign Halladay and he gets back to being Doc, I think we can make another run at this!"

Worst part is that Amaro may well be one of those people.

With all these walks, Doc would fit right in with the bullpen.

The comments to this entry are closed.

EST. 2005

Top Stories

HardballTalk

Rotoworld News

Follow on Twitter

Follow on Facebook

Contact Weitzel

CSG