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Saturday, May 04, 2013

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"Coming from the mechanical wonder,"

Just beautiful from a guy who usually doesn't say very much.

"Going back reading through those Lee/Halladay trade threads is trippy . . .

-BAP slamming TTI for calling him negative, and saying "Iceman has recently showed up to join in" on slamming him.""

If I really did write that, I hope the statute of limitations hasn't expired on my ability to declare Beerleaguer bankruptcy. Not on the part about slamming TTI or saying that Iceman has arrived to join him. But the part where I said, "has showed."

When your mechanics are so bad that everyone in baseball remembers your awful deivery 20 years after you pitched, you aren't allowed to comment on other people's mechanics.
This isn't to say analysts can't comment on guys who are better than they were or that people who didn't play can't talk about the game. It would be like tuning in to baseball tonight in 2035 and hearing Ryan Howard talk about stretching a double into a triple.

At first glance, his response reeks of "thou doth protest too much," but Mitch should have been put in his place. Dubee needs to answer for Halladay's struggles and Hamels' and Lee's inconsistency, but Mitch isn't in a position to know Dubee's responsibility for their performance.

Remember, Charlie looks like a lame duck. There is no guarantee that Sandberg, if he's the new manager, retains Dubee. Until Amaro lays out a succession plan, this will be a distraction.

REpost:

"Selig should be embarrassed that 2 owners were allowed to pocket money hand over fist while putting such pathetic products on the field."

MG, you are correct that Selig "should" be embarrassed, but he's not.

Selig is 'still' the commissioner because he's put billions into owners' pockets. As long as they collectively make money - and they do - that's all he cares about.

You see, if he really cared about the fans would it cost $7.75 for a decent beer at the Zen? Would a hotdog cost $5 as Sh8tti Field? Would a crappy baseball cap cost $20 at Fenway?

Fans be damned.


http://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2011/05/17/5-ballparks-ding-wallet/

I'm waiting for MG's comment on this.

Here's a spot where you can figure what it costs to eat at 26 of the MLB ballparks.

http://money.cnn.com/2013/03/31/pf/baseball-prices/index.html

Oh, and kudos to Halladay. He did the right thing. I enjoy Mitchiepoo's commentary, but he was a little off base.

Dubee ain't the guy out there on the mound hurling the baseball, and cannot control whether a pitcher hangs a breaking pitch.

"Coming from the mechanical wonder," -- Halladay should shut his mouth and show some respect... If it wasn't for Mitch and his 43 saves, the steroid-injected 1993 team would have Never made the playoffs, much less beat Atlanta to reach the series. And Roy-boy, how many World Series games have you appeared in as a Phillie? Zero! How many League Championship rings do you own? That's right-- Zero. Mitch has one!Roy, you're old, washed up and your career will only go downhill even further-- be open to any advice anyone is willing to give you.

Selig should've moved the Marlins to the AL and changed their logo to an alligator with a blue cap on. That way, the Cubs could beat them in a "million to one shot" in the 2015 World Series.

Maybe some flying cars and Mr. Fusion would be cool too.

Tyler:

So...I guess that means that Mitchie-poo won't be inviting Halladay to HIS induction in Cooperstown.

Wait...

tyler shut up you insecure, thin skinned, clueless douche bag

Did Williams take personal shots?

Did Halladay?

Point to Mitch.

If an argument isn't valid, attack it on its merits. Ad hominem attacks just make the attacker look like he has nothing substantive to say.

Also, Halladay pointed to Kendrick. Great. It just took 6 years and the tutelage of some great pitchers, but ok. We will give that one to Dubee, I guess.

What happened to all the young kids who were supposed to rescue our bullpen and who seem to have regressed since being a part of the big league club.

Bueller? Bueller?

Maybe they weren't good enough?

That is an awesome response by Doc. "Coming from a mechanical wonder", Ha!

If Mitch dare try to say anything in response, the MLB Network should just fire him now. There's no argument over pitching that Mitch Williams can win against Roy Halladay, regardless how much he may have lost it this season.

Heather: "If an argument isn't valid, attack it on its merits. Ad hominem attacks just make the attacker look like he has nothing substantive to say."

The merit of Mitch's response that Doc attacked is that Mitch Williams has absolutely no insight to what goes on between Dubee and his pitchers, which is the truth.

Tyson Gillies is back in Reading? Oh, jeez, why me?

Actually, awh, a hotdog at Citi Field costs 6.50--I was just there last weekend!

Also, I don't think what Mitch said is out of line at all. If pitching coaches get the credit when their staff does well, they should get some of the blame when things go wrong too. It's true that neither Mitch nor anyone else looking from the outside is really in a position to know, but all hecan do is raise these questions. If Halladay & Hamels are fighting through injuries or something, they could tell us. But Halladay isn't actually offering any explanation for why Mitch is wrong, just asserting that he is. Rings hollow to me.

We all know that Mitch's little "Dubee should be fires" claim came as a direct result of Dubee telling Williams not to talk to Kendrick, right?
Dubee told Williams to not talk to his pitchers when Williams tried to teach Kendrick a split-fingered fastball. Clear as day right there. Williams didn't like Dubee telling him to go away and now Williams is talking nonsense because of it. Simple as that.

Mitch may or may not have insight into the Phil's clubhouse. I dunno. I think old players still usually have contacts in the org, so he may well.

But bottom line, we judge managers and coaches by their results, and outside of Kendrick and Madson, I can't really think of any Dubee success stories.

Mitch was well within his rights to criticize Dubee's track record, and I'm not sure where Halladay gets off being so huffy and criticizing Mitch as an individual.

It's almost as if minor league pitchers might face substantially more talented opponents upon reaching the big leagues.

Seeing Halladay's response--defending an accomplished friend and colleague against an ignoramus--as somehow uncalled for is pretty bizarre. I suppose you can view Michael Schwimmer's failures as definitive proof of Dubees' incompetence, but since 2008 the Phillies have been consistently above average in league pitching WAR. Though admittedly, Kendricks transition from sub-mediocrity to stellar took several years, so...

Correction: Saddled with literally statistically the worst closer in history, as well as pre-good KK and remains of Jamie Moyer, the Phillies finished 9 of 16 in pitcher WAR. Of course, a good pitching coach would by then have had KK cutting opposing line-ups to pieces.

Does Dubee get credit for the success of Worely and Happ when they were here considering how bad they have been elsewhere?

Yes, fininishing mid pack in WAR since 2008 with Halladay, Lee, Oswalt and Hamels in the rotation speaks very well of Dubee's ability.

That's damning with faint praise if I ever heard it.

My dear Heather, above-average doesn't mean midpack:

2012: 4th
2011: 1st
2010: 5th
2009: 9th
2008: 6th

So, what's the basis for thinking Dubee's incompetent?

You said 9 of 16 in pitcher WAR? Sounded mid pack to me.

So, for you 2009 is a five-year period?

I would love to hang around for briefings on Halladay, Dubee, et al v Williams but the new batting cages at 6th and Girard opened today. It's called Everybody Hits. No promo. I just want to hit baseballs.

Klaus has this one taken care of.

I'll let people know if the place is any good.

2009 they had Hamels stinker of a year, Moyer's near 5 ERA (25 starts), Myers with a near 5 ERA (10 starts), Rolo with a near 6 ERA (in 5 starts)...it's a surprise they weren't worse than 9th.

Oh, that silly Wild Thing. One would think that, given how vindictive Philadelphia sports fans are and his very personal role in derailing the Phillies' only World Series appearance for a generation, he'd keep his big mouth shut and hope folks would just forget he ever existed.

But nope! Good thing YouTube exists to allow me to relive the murder of my childhood on that October night in 1993. I actually _had_ forgotten how ugly Williams was on the hill. "Mechanical wonder", indeed.

This is a non-story and wouldn't have even appeared if the Phils' starters weren't struggling as much as they have.

It is kind of funny how what Halladay said contradicts what KK said just the other day about his changeup. KK said it was self taught and the biggest influence was Lehr at LV in '09 (who learned it from Hudson). No mention of Dubee.

I not sure what to make of Dubee's tenure here. Couple of starters have come up and pitched pretty well while the relievers have generally floundered. To what extent Dubee has played in that I don't know you seriously analyze it one way or the other.

If Dubee is the one who is responsible for telling coach on when to make pitching moves in a game and Cholly largely heeds that advice, then my opinion of Dubee takes a real hit.

Williams can be pretty insightful but he clearly overstepped his bounds here. Little/no idea what is going on behind closed doors nor did he pitch with Dubee as his pitching coach.

The only way that Williams' claims would have some real credence is if a couple of pitchers came to him privately & were complaining about Dubee.

Highly doubt that is the case. It just seems like Williams got miffed when Dubee (who seems to be a bit of a sour puss) told him to f off this spring.

If Cholly goes (and he will one way or another), then Dubee goes too.

That's clear as day.

Mitch made those comments to WIP's morning show. I'm pretty sure its a prerequisite to suggest someone's firing to come on that show. The other morning they were already asking for the new pope to get canned.

The WIP morning show is about as high quality as shopping at 52nd and Market in west philly.

Halladay also voiced support of pillowbiting bullies so I would rather have someone else be the clubhouse leader.

Myoung's 2 GIDPs yesterday earned him a blow today. Galvis starting at 3rd.

Itz Wurs, you are obviously a moron but please explain what in god's name you are referring to. I hope it isn't a shot at Doc for appearing the "It gets better" video a few years ago.

Also, Everybody Hits is pretty legit. 3 cages and each one has options for softball or baseball and 3 different speeds. I like it.

I've never cared for Dubee. He comes off as an arrogant jerk. And Halladay lost me when he threw Kratz to the wolves. The little hissies w/ umpires when things didn't break his way were unprofessional enough. If he had an issue w/ his catcher he should have brought it up w/ his catcher, not the press.

Mitch Williams is an arrogant piece of garbage. It's about time that someone more respectable than Curt Shilling takes the time to show him up.

That hack sure had gotten a lot of mileage out of blowing the World Series. It's funny...Buckner isn't hosting the NESN postgame show.

mitch williams is a BLATHERING IDIOT. don't believe me? watch MLB network; he is clueless and borderline retarded. this guy makes a living on that network MAKING THINGS UP about players...he knows nothing. idiot.

Is this the same Halladay who appeared to be blaming Kratz for a pitch someone hit for a three-run home run about a month ago? The same Halladay who did the exact same thing in many Kratz-less games last summer? Why doesn't Halladay worry about about being loyal to his teammates and not sniffing Dubious Dubee's jock?

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