Game chat: Brown back in as Cloyd draws Cincy

Domonic Brown returns to the Phillies lineup against right-handed Cy Young candidate Johnny Cueto when the Phillies open a Labor Day set in Cincinnati. First pitch is 1:05. Right-hander Tyler Cloyd takes his second turn in the Phillies' rotation as the hometown nine tries to forget Sunday night's painful loss in Atlanta. Steven Larud starts behind the plate. Juan Pierre will be in left with John Mayberry Jr.'s hot bat assigned to center field. [Jump to the newest comments]

Comments

[lorecore]

repost(and correction):

Glad to see DOM back in the lineup, when he's not in the lineup, there really isn't any individual worth paying attention to. i guess Kratz is a close second, and then the pair Aumont/DeFratus.

Everyone else has basically no chance to change their reputation/expectation for next year in these last 30 games

Correction: I forgot about Cloyd, he probably makes the list ahead of Kratz only because Ruiz is the guaranteed starter no matter how well he plays, and Cloyd might have a chance to keep Kendrick as a swingman.

[lorecore]

MiniMart Watch:

The last player to post a negative OPS+ in at least 100 PA was the Reds' Brandon Larson back in 2003, with a .101/.212/.146 slashline in 104 PA.

Martinez is currently at a 2 OPS+ with 80 PA on the year. He's really benefiting from the 2 HR he hit, that .081 ISO is much higher than most of the negative OPS club.

[bay_area_phan]

If you can't get fired up about Mini-Mart's pursuit of a 0 OPS+ season, you aren't a real baseball fan.

[EastFallowfield]

Watching the Phils laugh it up in the dugout makes me think the hangover from yesterday hits us phans harder than the pros.

[limoguy]

Cloyd dominates and Phils win. Place your bets now.

[bay_area_phan]

Brandon Larson actually had back-to-back seasons of 1.000+ OPS at AAA -- including a 1.001 OPS in the very same season that he had that -2 OPS+ in the majors. He also had posted a .900+ OPS in 58 major league PAs the previous season.

Those who are so inclined will use those numbers to make a commentary about Darrin Ruf or Kevin Frandsen. But I will use them to make an entirely different point: despite Larson's woefully bad 2003 numbers, the Reds were not completely out of their gourds to give him 104 PAs that year. I can offer no such defense when it comes to the Phillies & Mini-Mart.

[bay_area_phan]

If you believe Gameday, Cloyd began the game with an 86 MPH fastball, then followed up with an 84 MPH changeup.

Unless he has the worst changeup in the history of major league baseball, something tells me that 84 MPH pitch was his fastball.

[Chuck A.]

If the Phils and Cloyd win today it almost negates yesterday's debacle. But time is running out or has really run out so it really doesn't much matter.

[GBrettFan]

Per Matt Gelb:

Michael Martinez is chasing history (of the wrong kind):
Martinez enters Monday with a .122 batting average in 80 plate appearances. That is the third lowest for a Phillies position player in team history (min. 80 PA):

1. Gene Corbett: .080 (82 PA in 1938)
2. John Dodge: .120 (102 PA in 1912)
3. Michael Martinez: .122 (80 PA in 2012)
4. Chuck Klein: .123 (84 PA in 1941)
5. Joe Morgan: .133 (89 PA in 1960)

[BMS]

Mini-Mart running with some HOF company in Klein and Morgan, so maybe it's a little early to pass judgment.......(winks)

[bay_area_phan]

Apparently, our AAA coaching staff neglected to teach Dom than when the other guy call for the ball, you get the hell out of the way.

[R.Billingsly]

Watching the Phils laugh it up in the dugout makes me think the hangover from yesterday hits us phans harder than the pros.

It better. They have another game to play in less than 24 hours. They can't dwell on it.

[R.Billingsly]

Jay Bruce has been on a bit of a tear recently, huh?

[ColonelTom]

At the game. Cloyd is topping out at 86 on the (usually high) stadium gun.

[EastFallowfield]

I have a feeling today's outcome depends more on Cueto vs Cloyd than any hangover from the weekend. Maybe there's a cliche to cite there somewhere.

[sdphillie]

85-87 tops on the FB so far, and just threw a 75mph (split?) changeup.

No walks so far lead me to believe that he's a much younger Jamie Moyer, or a non-Knuckling Tim Wakefield.

[MoonDoggie]

Great pitchers dominate great hitters.

[SLO Phan]

Seriously disappointed no MM today. Hopefully UC will pinch hit him later. Watching his BA drop like a safe is one of the reasons to watch this team right now.

[lolwut]

regardless of the outcome, this is a great AB by howard.

[curt]

Possibly Howard's best AB this year. Good sign.

[bay_area_phan]

When the Phillies lose this game 1-0, I suspect we'll look back at that 13-pitch weak ground out as the offensive highlight of the game.

[BMS]

Don't think it will be a 1-0 final, but it sure feels like it will be ?-0.

[bay_area_phan]

I don't think a single Juan Pierre start goes by without at least one opposing player taking an extra base that he could not have taken against any other left fielder in baseball.

[curt]

Anytime neither Pierre nor Frandsen are in the lineup this team is a good candidate to be no hit, not merely shut out.

[GTown_Dave]

If you can't get fired up about Mini-Mart's pursuit of a 0 OPS+ season, you aren't a real baseball fan.

I eagerly await the stirringly overwrought Joe Posnanski piece.

[GTown_Dave]

Cloyd is already a better hitter than the aforementioned Martinez.

[sdphillie]

Wow, Cloyd has about as much hair as Dustin Pedroia. Did not expect to see that from the 25 year old rookie.

[GBrettFan]

Yeah, Jimmy!

1 more hit to 2000!

[lolwut]

beast mode!

[bullit]

ageless james !!!

[curt]

Called that.

[GTown_Dave]

Not a bad effort for No. 1,999 there, J-Roll. But now ya gotta hit a Slam for No. 2,000.

[Chuck A.]

Where are all the J-Roll haters?

[wes covington's ghost]

Waiting for a pop-up....

[bay_area_phan]

These Reds announcers keep calling these 83 and 84 MPH pitches changeups. But considering that his fastest pitch of the game has been 86 MPH, that seems awfully dubious.

In spite of that, he actually looks quite good.

[Edmundo]

Chuck, I'll say something positive. Jimmy ran harder on the HR than he does on his pop-ups.

[Unikruk]

It's only his second start and his first time around the league, but it's not hard to be impressed with Cloyd's early results. If he can stop leaving those hangers over the middle, he's got enough movement to keep his head above water. I'm rooting for him.

[EastFallowfield]

Great pitchers dominate great hitters.

Hence, the Reds have only one run so far.

[EastFallowfield]

August/Septberry!

[bullit]

mabes !!!

[Edmundo]

John AAAAberry is turning into John Maybeberry.

[Unikruk]

So Howard follows up his great AB with a horrendous, embarrassing strikeout. Just flailing at junk again.

[bay_area_phan]

Mayberry's being a pain. If he continues surging, he might just end up with a respectable enough OPS to end up in our starting OF again next year -- at which time he'll again proceed to stink for the first 5 months of the season.

[Chuck A.]

So maybe the Phils need to keep Mayberry at AAA until August and then call him up since he does his damage late in the season. He and Chase can make their 2013 debuts at the same time.

[cut_fastball]

An enigma wrapped inside a riddle.

[GBrettFan]

Matt Gelb ‏@magelb
Tyler Cloyd's fastballs register as change-ups on Pitch F/X. He has six strikeouts.

Who compared him to Moyer? Not a bad comparison.

[can_of_corn]

I didn't expect this to be an enjoyable game to watch. It just goes to show that the game of baseball brings both good and bad surprises.

I'm worried about what happens in later innings, but for now I love the newbies' contributions (Cloyd, Lerud) and am enjoying Jimmy and John.

On paper this looked like a definite loss. So if we can pull it out, we're almost even from yesterday.

[bay_area_phan]

On the one hand, I look at this guy's stuff and I think there's no way he could ever have any sustained success at the major league level. On the other hand, today's outing is pretty much the prototype that led to this year's 15-1 minor league record and 2.26 ERA.

[BMS]

Murph's back! Woohoo!

[Chuck A.]

We could say that if they won yesterday and then again today they would be on a serious roll and be surging. But a win yesterday would have altered the natural course of events to where maybe a win today wouldn't have happened anyway. If that makes any sense...

[The hook]

Yeah I can see John being a fools gold player. Or like a fake rolex. Looks good on outside, but u known what it really is.

[MG]

Possible byline on the Daily Sports News:

'Cloyded'

[CN]

Another wonderful call by the official scorer.

[RR]

Nothing redeems yesterday's debacle. I agree, Chuck A., that winning would have altered the course of events, perhaps involving changing perceptions of the Phillies or the focus of different players, but the bottom-line was that, regardless of what had gone before or what was to come, they should have won. I admire the core's resilience. They've always been good at bouncing back, not that I'm suggesting this game feels like a win.

[can_of_corn]

8K in fewer than 7 complete innings. Wow

[GBrettFan]

Howard used to be pretty good at fielding (just not at throwing). Not sure what explains his problems with it this year. Could it be related to the Achilles?

[RR]

I have no way of proving it, but I think Rollins is boucning more balls to first than he has in the past, so maybe it isn't Howard.

[GTown_Dave]

GBrettFan: I was wondering the same thing. Howard used to be very adept at the stretch & scoop. Now he's not stretching, & taking the ball more in the chest.

[CousinIT]

Howard normally is pretty good with scoops. Possibly it's rust or maybe still some stiffness/ lack of flexibility in the Achilles. One of main goals in Achilles rehab is getting flexibility back in the ankle.

How can a non knuckle ball guy who throws 86 have 9 SO LOL

[wes covington's ghost]

That's OK, Howard, the rookie picked you up.

[RR]

... although I agree that Howard used to scoop better too. ... According to CRASH!, Dick Allen's memoir, Bowa used to complain about Allen's digging out throws at first. Allen's response to Bowa was "make better throws."

[can_of_corn]

Re: Howard. Don't know if anyone noticed, but when he was in the dugout he seemed quite dejected. Everyone else was moving around--I think after RFDs homer--but he stayed seated and unsmiling. I wasn't sure if he was hurting somewhere, upset with himself, or just resting.

[Iceman]

What an impressive outing by Cloyd. Smart dude.

Goes without saying this makes yesterday's loss all the more frustrating AA these guys look ready to go streaking.

[GBrettFan]

72 Ks in 172 ABs. Wow, Howie! He also has lots of RBIs, however.

[denny b.]

The Reds look uncomfortable against Cloyd.

Ball has a lot of late movement on the hands of right-handers and then he cuts it back on them. Lots of strange looking swings.

He looks like he knows exactly what he's doing out there and is very composed.

LeRud has done a nice job working with him today too.

[Iceman]

AA = as

[GBrettFan]

Game's not over yet, Iceman. There's still time for another blown save.

[RR]

Can_of_corn ... great observation. I've noticed that in the past ... replaying his AB, I hope

[can_of_corn]

My positive feelings are quickly turning to dread. In fact, irrationally, I'm already angry at Pap for blowing the save.

[Ryan Howard]

I need a day off.

[bay_area_phan]

I keep reading that DeFratus has a 95-96 MPH fastball, but this is the 2nd time he has been up to the majors and I still haven't seen any evidence of it.

[RR]

If he does blow it, it will be the manager's and pitching coach's fault, and will have its roots in last night's game.

[CousinIT]

DeFratus first impressions: Meh

[GBrettFan]

Why did LeRud have to come out before Dubee? I think Dubee waits too long to talk to a pitcher.

[RR]

Ha! Now the CIN announcers are second-guessing bringing DeFratus into this game.

[GBrettFan]

I think if only I stopped watching Phillies games after the 7th, I'd have been a lot less frustrated this year.

[can_of_corn]

Okay...dodged tbe bullet of the 8th. Nail-biting for the 9th

[GBrettFan]

Good job, team! Howard reached for the ball, even. Didn't have to scoop, but he did have to reach.

[bay_area_phan]

Someone other than Papelbon is going to close this game. He has pitched 3 days in a row.

[wes covington's ghost]

Nut up Cholly, Aumont to start the 9th. Do it!

[can_of_corn]

I could be mistaken, but I think I remember hearing earlier in the broadcast that Cholly and Dubee had told Pap to be ready.

[denny b.]

BAP-

Where did you read that?

DeFratus has a hard, heavy sinker that tops out at 93-94 MPH.

He's tough on righties, who can get swings and misses when his slider is biting.

He's always been tough to hit, though.

[denny b.]

Pap should be out on the riverboat, gambling.

No way in hell, he pitches today.

[bay_area_phan]

denny: Probably on Phuture Phillies, but I can't recall for sure.

[Chuck A.]

Maybe Charlie will call on MiniMart to make an appearance in the 9th....you know...to ensure a loss somehow.

[RR]

No doubt they said, "Heh, we're resting you today, Pap, but be ready anyway." ... Watching the CIN broadcast, so who's warming up?

[Dickie Thong]

Matt Gelb (‏@magelb):
Phillippe Aumont will go for his first major-league save.

[GTown_Dave]

It's Aumont.

[bay_area_phan]

This has some serious ugliness potential.

[GBrettFan]

Rooting for Aumont here, not least because I don't want to have the aggravation of seeing Pap come in and blow it with runners on.

[RR]

CIN announcers suggesting that last night's BS and not rest is the reason JP is not in.

[CousinIT]

DeFratus scouting report from PP;

http://phuturephillies.com/profiles/pitchers/rhp-de-fratus-justin/

Based on it, was, will be expecting more

[GBrettFan]

Does BS stand for blown save or bullsh*t, RR?

[bay_area_phan]

GBrett: Papelbon has pitched 3 days in a row. He is surely unavailable today.

[GBrettFan]

BAP, and yet he was warming up, per the radio guys.

[bay_area_phan]

GBrett: Odd. Maybe Cholly wants to blow out his elbow so he won't be around next year.

[can_of_corn]

Dubee calling for someone else. Diekman?

[CousinIT]

Diekman up. They're back to playing matchups after a 1 game hiatus

[MG]

Mixed reports on Papelbon. Sure they will report on the game.

I imagine it is due to the heavy usage lately. Pitched in 3 of the last 4 days and had a pretty heavily workload overall the last month or so. Thrown 15.1 IP the last month in 15 G.

[bay_area_phan]

When Aumont & Diekman are Cholly's preferred options in a save situation, I think we can safely infer that he has finally given up on the season.