Game chat: Papelbon seeks an inning of work tonight

The Phillies have 99 problems and hustle ain't one. The 44-game learning experience continues when Vance Worley takes the hill against Yovani Gallardo in the second of four from Miller Park. First pitch is 8:10. The Phils' bullpen has blown two-straight games. All-Star and $50 million closer Jonathan Papelbon, pictured right in case you've forgotten what he looks like, goes in search of his seventh inning of work this month. [Jump to the newest comments]

Comments

[Stocky Vance]

http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?sid=milb&t=g_box&gid=2012_08_17_breafa_clrafa_1

[Steve]

So is ChollyM the latest incarnation of Rich/coolhandluke?

[ChollyM]

No I'm the Dahli Lama

[MG]

If the Phils don't score in the 9th, they will drop to 112 runs in 32 games since the ASB (3.53 R/G). Good enough for 14th in the NL.

Only the lowly Astros & Marlins will be worse and they aren't far behind.

[NEPP]

Yeah, Biddle had pretty much the best start of the year for him.

He's our #1 prospect at this point...hell, on some lists he was the #1 going into 2012 as some realized that May was overrated.

It will be interesting to see how Reading does next year and there will be a good handful of legit prospects there in 2013.

[MG]

Come down to the fact that if the starter gives up a multi-run HR, there is a good chance the Phils will lose if there is even a semi-competent starter on the mound opposing them.

[3r0ck]

http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?sid=milb&t=g_box&gid=2012_08_17_breafa_clrafa_1

Posted by: Stocky Vance | Friday, August 17, 2012 at 10:45 PM

How about Polly! 3 for 5 with an RBI

[MG]

Phils will have given up 134 runs.

Outscoured, outgunned, and outmanned as they drop to 17-15 since the ASB.

[NEPP]

Yeah but hes not even close to age-appropriate for the league. He's a career minor-leaguer.

[ChollyM]

And we are fortunate to have scored 1 run.

[Stocky Vance]

'as some realized that May was overrated.'

How come he has fallen so far? or maybe he wasn't as good as the talent pundits made him out to be...

[NEPP]

Livan Hernandez has pitched for every NL East team beside the Phillies....including stints with both the Expos and Nationals.

Rube needs to sign him next year so he can complete the set.

[ChollyM]

Way to smash that ball Dom.

[NEPP]

***How come he has fallen so far? or maybe he wasn't as good as the talent pundits made him out to be...***

He jumped up last year in his 2nd full season in Clearwater after his BB rate dropped significantly. Scouts thought he had taken a big step forward. However, some (like me) were a bit skeptical because he was repeating a level and he still wasnt that dominant. He's been terrible at AA as he doesnt have much command or good secondary pitches.

If he makes it to the Majors, it will be as a reliever.

[Chris Wheeler]

and that's what the no doubles defense is for.

[ChollyM]

68 mph curveball

[Stocky Vance]

If he [may] makes it to the Majors, it will be as a reliever.

Posted by: NEPP | Friday, August 17, 2012 at 10:59 PM

o boy -- another effective reliever from the phillies farm system,,

[GTown_Dave]

20 games back. What a year.

[NEPP]

At least we're locking up that Top 10 draft pick.

We should be able to get one hell of a toolsy OF if we pick that high.

Or maybe an actual prospect.

[ChollyM]

The players are taking a que from their manager. He's not playing to win so why should they?

[ChollyM]

If I was Cole, I'd call in sick tomorrow.

[gjs]

Protected first round pick becoming more secure.

[mainerob]

What's a "que," ChollyM? Do you mean "cue"?

[Phlipper]

Missed the game tonight - just saw some highlights. Brutal.

Just wondering how that Brown-lovin' is doing here at BLer. For years I've been reading that Charlie and RAJ are morons for not putting Brown in the lineup and leaving him there.

Jack leading the charge if I'm not mistaken. NEPP explaining there's no reason to think that Brown should perform at a solid level at AAA for a good chunk of time before we conclude he was ready for the majors.

That was one ugly play in right field.

So, what's the verdict? Have the BLer man-crushes started to sour on Brown yet, or are they still hanging in there?

[Bubba]

Phlipper- Where did you find highlights of tonight's game?
They surely didn't appear during the game broadcast.
We are playing lousy baseball.

[MG]

Same so bland that the Facebook highlight is 'Phillies fail to Brewers.' Not a single highlight.

[3r0ck]

DBrown has had 63 plate appearances. He's not the problemn.

[Bubba]

Saw this in Larry Shenks column:
August 17, 1957: CF Richie Ashburn, known for his ability to foul pitches off, hits spectator Alice Roth twice in the same at-bat. The first one breaks her nose; the second hits her while she is being removed on a stretcher. Ironically, she is the wife of Earl Roth, sports editor of the Philadelphia Bulletin.

Other than that, Mrs Lincoln, how was the play?

[Luis]

What did Dom Brown do? Havent been watching the games. Or is the normal Bl'er pansy bitching. Anyways by now Rube should know this team is in trouble for next year as well. The team is handcuffed with too many high salaried players. I think in order to compete Rube will probably have to give up one of his Aces. Get a cheaper option like that Marchum dude. Oh what is Rube to do, to right the ship when the pilot is blind in one eye and death in one ear and has a ego the size of Mt Kilimanjaro.

[Iceman]

I love how MG and others act like this team is playing with a full deck right now.

At least three positions are being filled by players that will not be starters next year. Hopefully four.

What a surprise that the offense is terrible! Look at the lineup and get a clue.

[aksmith]

Looks like I picked a good time to stop watching baseball for a few days.

Looks like I picked a good time to start sniffing airplane glue.

I watched a lot of bad Phillies teams from 1964 up until the early part of this season. I suffered along with all Phillies fans at the hopelessness of being a Phillies fan. They were simply never going to get better and nobody in the F.O. gave a s@#t. Just like Scott Rolen said.

But I find that after having watched a very good team the last five years, I no longer feel like watching this wretched mess. I click through to find the score and if they're losing, I move on to something productive.

That's the danger of having a good team. When the fallow period comes, people find that they have a life and it's time to go live it with less Phillies baseball.

When Rube fixes this mess, I'll be back on more than an occasional basis. Hopefully, as soon as the beginning of next season. But at my age, I don't want to watch the opposite of competence.

I suppose that makes me a frontrunner. But having watched so much losing baseball during my lifetime, I'm not sure anyone has the right to criticize anyone for not wanting to watch meaningless baseball anymore.

[norbertods]

Aksmith: You don't have to explain yourself. Someone (can't remember who) posted a while back that baseball is supposed to be entertainment. Just like all spectator sports are. At this point, the phillies are the antithesis of entertainment. If you know a movie is gonna suck, you're not going to watch, right?

As for me, I'll still stop by to read the posts (much more entertaining), just can't bring myself to set aside 2-3 hours to watch this train wreck. If that makes me a frontrunner, so be it.

[ChollyM]

"What's a "que," ChollyM? Do you mean "cue"?"

I dunno, that's so complicated. D'oh. We hit some balls, we caught some balls, we sucked some balls...

[DH Phils]

It seems like it's this time of the season, as others above alluded to:

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/reversestandings2012

Kind-of perverse, but realistic after losing 3 in a row to bad teams.

[The Hook]

Did something way more productive and had full attention. Fantasy draft. Just saw highlights. Can they start playing some of the minor league games? Would rather see guys like biddle, Gilles, and Franco play. Glad football starts in a few.

[DanielB]

late to the chat. Has anyone wondered why Cholly didn't go for a 4 out save with Pap instead of bringing in the Dodger on Thursday night?

[clout]

aksmith: "I'm not sure anyone has the right to criticize anyone."

Translation: No one has the right to criticize ME!

[clout]

Iceman: Good point. You replace Pence, Vic and Chooch with Mayberry, Brown and Schneider, what the hell do you think will happen to the offense?

[clout]

May and Colvin have higher velocity than Biddle.

Just sayin'

[clout]

The decision to recall someone to the major league level is made jointly by the manager, GM and minor league staff.

There are many, many, many players who post gaudy minor league stats, but fail miserably in the big leagues.

Good scouts and coaches can look beyond the stats to a player's skill set and project whether he can surive MLB hitters or pitchers. That's an element that goes into the decision, but is unseen and unacknowledged by fans.

[clout]

Hewitt watch: His K/BB ratio is 120/15.

That is an improvement over last season. It is especially an improvement over 2010 when his ratio was 12/1.

[Fire UC]

"late to the chat. Has anyone wondered why Cholly didn't go for a 4 out save with Pap instead of bringing in the Dodger on Thursday night?"

Because he is mentally retarded?

[NEPP]

***

May and Colvin have higher velocity than Biddle.

Just sayin'
***

May's velocity is why he's dominating AA.

[aksmith]

I think it's more fun watching Clout have a conversation with Clout than watching this Phillies team.

I have a serious question. How old are you, Clout?

I have known people who lived long lives and died having seen only one WS win from a Phillies team and four WS appearances from them. (They died prior to 2008). These were some diehard Phillies fans. And because of various factors, imcompetence and cheapness being the two major ones, died having watched many decades of bad baseball. Looking back on it, it seems pretty pathetic. I wouldn't tolerate that kind of performance in anything I had actual input into. But since all fans can do is watch and wait, we are expected to spend our money and spend our time watching people fail in all kinds of ways.

Now that the Phillies are no longer the most racist team in baseball as back in the 50's, nor one of the cheapest, all that is left is incompetence. I think Rube has a very short window to prove that he isn't incompetent.

But what is on the field now is unwatchable. That is not a professionally run, professionally managed team of professional baseball players. If feel for the guys who are injured or playing through pain, as Worley seems to be and Chooch most certainly was. And I feel for the really talented guys who are unable to physically recover fast enough, such as Utley and Howard.

But I've watched enough of throwing to the wrong base. Running the bases like a little leaguer who had a stroke. And watching marginal AAA talent, yes, Clout, Minimart, hold a roster spot.

I am watching some minor league, mostly AAA, baseball. The quality isn't major league, but it's not that much different than what is going on with the Phillies.

Clout, you can criticize away. But I am getting too old to watch incompetence. If this is just an injury riddled season and a bunch of bad luck, then the bounce back will be quick. Somehow, I think it's more a case of needing major retooling and the bounceback is looking further and further away.

If the Phillies can maintain the present level of awful, they may sneak into the top ten draft picks. They say it's a weak draft, but projections being what they are, the scouts are rarely right about such things. And I think the Phillies' days of drafting toolsheds who can't play baseball are a thing of the past. With the new draft rules, toolsheds have been relegated to later rounds where they always belonged. It's possible Rube can bust the luxury threshold on a couple of top free agents AND grab a prospect to dream on. Then next year, I can again watch enjoyable baseball.

I've watched a lot of bad baseball over my lifetime, most of it perpetrated by the Phillies. This last ten years or so has been quite different. Rube has presided over a collapse of the best era of Phillies baseball so far. I'll be watching more next season, hoping that he's smarter and more capable than I think he is.

[curt]

"I've watched a lot of bad baseball over my lifetime, most of it perpetrated by the Phillies. This last ten years or so has been quite different. Rube has presided over a collapse of the best era of Phillies baseball so far. I'll be watching more next season, hoping that he's smarter and more capable than I think he is."

Me too.

[Lake Fred]

Following this year's Phillies team, coming after a 102 win season, is like a bad dream. Since they seem to lose everyday, I would hope that one morning, I will roll out of bed, check the standings and see the Phillies back in 1st place. Unfortunately, I think that day will be in the year 2027.

[wes covington's ghost]

Dr.ak- You have my voice.Just a wonderfully stated post reflecting many of our thoughts on this retched season. Thank you, and carry on.

[ChollyM]

Careful wes. The geniuses here will mock you for spelling wretched wrong.

[Bake McBride was Here]

This sucks.

[cut_fastball]

aksmith -- Wow! Amazing post. I agree with every word. However, I'm not as optimistic about the "bounce-back".

The incompetence of the FO -- solely from the standpoint of planning for and acting upon injuries to key players, is all at once breathtaking and suffocating. RAJ's inability to flip Lee plus cash for prospects -- heck, how did the Dodgers or Rangers not participate? - virtually guaranteed a team riddled with holes at 3rd, and the OF; and absent depth at catcher and 2nd base for at least 3 - 5 years.

I really can't see the Phillies, with the minor leagues and the 40 man as currently configured, as a seriously contending team for at least another 5 - 7 years. Too many old, fading players -- some with horrific attitude problems (that's you, Jimmy) -- and many with untradable contracts, lock us into mediocrity for the coming 5 years. Anyone with a road map that shows another way, please share!

[Fatalotti]

Wow, is Andrew McCutchen amazing or what?

.360/.426/.605, .430 wOBA, 175 wRC+, 6.4 fWAR

Apparently, though, he does play a bit of a below average CF (according to bbref and FG), so maybe with those offensive numbers, he's more suited for a corner OF spot.

But still, those numbers are just ridiculous.

[docjoe]

"Wow, is Andrew McCutchen amazing or what?"

He doesn't seem to have that lazy gene...

[lorecore]

Brown looked like a former highschool WR with a case of aligator arms on the ball in the RF gap, made good ground and a good read/route on the play, but just didnt follow it into his glove once he felt the wall closing in.

[bullit]

and that was a player-friendly flat padded wall. not the "cage match" wall we have at the bank.

[Fatalotti]

"Wow, is Andrew McCutchen amazing or what?"

He doesn't seem to have that lazy gene...

Posted by: docjoe | Saturday, August 18, 2012 at 03:29 PM

I don't know whether your racist, or just stupid, but please stop posting here.

[Fatalotti]

And yes, I realize I used "your" instead of "you're"

[bullit]

every stadium has different walls. so i'm sure the outfielders check them out pretty well before tha game. i think the of walls should be more standardized and made as safe as possible. sorry wrigley. and cover them with advertising like the old time parks.

a question is, what do we expect from our outfielders in terms of wall play? do we expect them to crash into or scale the walls regularly, for our entertainment?

[GTown_Dave]

Good scouts and coaches can look beyond the stats to a player's skill set and project whether he can surive MLB hitters or pitchers. That's an element that goes into the decision, but is unseen and unacknowledged by fans.

The above standards seem to suggest the Phillies have more than a few less-than-good scouts & coaches.

[abercrombie france]

Pour ne pas être à l'intérieur du comprendre le plus souvent, je suis enclin à n'aimez pas les messages concernant ce sujet progressivement supplémentaires considérez que vous êtes à l'écrire à la mode outre vos moyens personnels, nous avons obtenu de dire, c'est vraiment, vraiment une belle publier de ceux à retenir.