Josh Lindblom, a 6-6 second-round pick in the 2008 draft and former closer for Purdue, has a 3.02 ERA and 43/18 K/BB ratio in 47 2-3 innings for the Dodgers this season, pitching much better at home (1.05) than away (5.32). The knock on Lindblom, 25, who is arbitration eligible in 2015 and a free agent in 2018, is his high flyball rate; he's allowed nine homers this season. The walks are no small issue, either. On the plus side, he's become acclimated to pitching late innings; 23 of his 47 2-3 innings have been in the 8th inning.
Ethan Martin, a 23-year-old former first-round pick of the Dodgers (15th overall) in the 2008 draft, was 8-6 with a 3.58 ERA and 112/61 K/BB ratio in 20 starts for Double-A Chattanooga. Baseball America rated him as the 17th best prospect in the Dodgers chain prior to the season, seeing plenty of raw potential and a No. 2 starter ceiling. Martin can reportedly dial it up to the high 90s, with an improving bender, but a below average change-up and developing slider. He is a work in progress and struggles with his command. He is second in the Southern League in both strikeouts and walks.
The deal also includes a player to be named later or cash, according to the Phillies.
Beerleaguer: It's pretty hard to sell to a contender and get a Major League player back in return. And a prospect of this caliber for a two-month rental. And if the Dodgers cover the rest of Shane Victorino's salary, Amaro will have done what he wanted here.
"Hunter Pence deal with the Giants does not include Gary Brown, Brandon Belt or Kyle Crick according to Philies source
Posted by: Slocs | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:28 PM"
If true, Rube has failed.
Posted by: Iceman | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:29 PM
JimBowdenESPNxm
Hunter Pence deal with the Giants does not include Gary Brown, Brandon Belt or Kyle Crick according to Philies source
Are you fvcking kidding me, Rube???
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:30 PM
Do the Giants have any deaf OFs or French Canadian relievers that we targeted instead?
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:31 PM
There's a middle ground between keeping Pence to compete in 2013 and trading him and forgetting about next year. That middle ground is massive.
Posted by: Sophist | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:31 PM
The only excuse for this is that the Padres/Indians have said "This is who we want from the Giants," and that's who Rube is targeting to acquire.
Outside of that, there is no excuse.
Posted by: Iceman | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:31 PM
Did we just buy really low on Lincecum?
Posted by: mm | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:31 PM
Come on, RAJ! Don't undervalue Pence! Don't be weak!
Posted by: GBrettfan | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:32 PM
Gelb: "Still hearing Wigginton to Yankees is a distinct possibility before 4 pm."
Pleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleaseplease ...
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:32 PM
I'm guessing the deal is centered around the very Sebastian Valle like catcher. Move one of them to third maybe?
Posted by: AlexRosie | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:33 PM
Tommy Joseph goes to Phils in Hunter Pence deal
by DKnobler via twitter
FAIL
Posted by: p. Red | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:33 PM
These threads are coming too fast.... :)
Posted by: awh | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:33 PM
Barry Zito on way to Philly - kidding...
Posted by: Slocs | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:34 PM
"I'm guessing the deal is centered around the very Sebastian Valle like catcher. Move one of them to third maybe?"
What a stupid, stupid decision, if true.
The only upside to this will be that Amaro, like many of us wanted, is going to spend big on a FA this off-season. But good God, you can get more return than that for Pence.
Posted by: Iceman | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:34 PM
MASSIVE FAIL if we got Joseph.
MASSIVE FAIL
FIRE RUBE NOW!
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:34 PM
DKnobler @DKnobler
Tommy Joseph goes to Phils in Hunter Pence deal
Posted by: Bill | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:34 PM
So Headley, Bourn or Chin Soo Woo would all have to be possibilities then for 2013.
Posted by: Chuck A. | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:35 PM
That's brutal.
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:35 PM
Matt Gelb @magelb
Still hearing Wigginton to Yankees is a distinct possibility before 4 pm.
Wonder if we'll get Ibanez back? That would be some irony! I'm kidding. Ibanez can't be cheaper than Wiggy.
Posted by: GBrettfan | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:35 PM
Very nervous about the idea of losing both Pence & Vic. Sophist's middle ground is indeed vast, and have no idea where the Phils end up.
Posted by: Bob | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:36 PM
Great. So we're looking at Pence to SF for Aubrey Huff & a Panda hat?
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:36 PM
Can we wait until we find out what the deal is before we pass judgment?
Posted by: DH Phils | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:36 PM
If Vic and Pence are both gone, I think it signals that Rube will go hard after someone like Michael Bourne next season. Or he could try to sign Vic again, though I think that is less likely.
Posted by: donc | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:36 PM
Tommy Joseph to the Phils is what's being reported. One of Giants top 5 prospects coming into the season. Here's one writeup:
I like the way he improved his defense, also has standout power, hit 22 homers in High-A at age 19/20. Strike zone judgment remains poor and precludes higher grade, but he projects as a regular catcher if he can improve his approach.
Posted by: Kendrick Appreciation Society | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:36 PM
Rube is just clearing salary so he can offer Josh Hamilton a 10 year deal in the off-season.
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:36 PM
Who's Tommy Joseph again, please?
Posted by: GBrettfan | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:36 PM
AT, yes Vic was traded, but he can always be signed as an FA once the season is over.
All of you lamenting the fact that they'll have to replace Vic in the OF next season miss the point that Vic's 2013 replacement may very well be.....Vic.
Also, moving Pence will eventually be seen as MORE IMPORTANT than moving Vic, who can still be brought back.
His salary will be much higher, IMHO, in 2013 than will Vic's, and the salary relief in 2013 will allow tham more flexibility.
Posted by: awh | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM
Maybe Valle or Joseph will be in a trade for Headley?
Posted by: AlexRosie | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM
Tommy Joseph?? Are you serious??
Posted by: Chuck A. | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM
Next year's OF will be Brown, Nix and Mini Mart?
Posted by: Willard Preacher | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM
I'm hearing joseph and Schierholtz....Boo!!!
Posted by: DPatrone | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM
Josh Lindblom @JoshLindblom52
Thanks to everyone for all of the great memories. Couldn't be more excited to join an organization that is dedicated to bring a championship
Posted by: GBrettfan | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM
Oh no - Tommy Joseph - means Phillies caved. Let's see how much cash was included.
Posted by: Slocs | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:38 PM
I guess the Luxury Tax ceiling for 2012 and possibly 2013, and the budgetary concerns to get under that ceiling is king for the Phils.
Despite what quite a few posters have been denying for a while.
I seem to remember somebody saying that the Phils don't need to worry about budgets.
Posted by: Five-4-One | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:38 PM
r00b is just cleaning salary.
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:38 PM
Baseball America had Joseph as the Giants 2nd rated prospect coming into the season.
Posted by: Kendrick Appreciation Society | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:38 PM
"Very nervous about the idea of losing both Pence & Vic. Sophist's middle ground is indeed vast, and have no idea where the Phils end up."
Bob, Vic is only lost for the next 2 months.
He can always be signed as an FA in the offseason.
Posted by: awh | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:39 PM
DH Phils- we're passing judgment on the reported deal. That's why I'm stipulating my criticism with 'if true.'
If true, and we're getting Joseph and Schierholtz for Pence, that is a massive, massive failure on account of the FO.
Posted by: Iceman | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:39 PM
***I'm hearing joseph and Schierholtz....Boo!!!***
I think I just threw up in my mouth.
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:39 PM
I didnt like Nate Schierholtz when his name was Ben Francisco. I doubt I'll like him any better now.
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:40 PM
GTown, agree. The 2012 salary dump has commenced.
Posted by: awh | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:40 PM
So, RAJ said the Phils weren't "selling" but rather "improving" yet these moves all reek of shedding pay role.
Is he that shortsighted to make moves to get/stay under the tax and take a "we'll figure it out in the offseason" approach?
And I'm only half-kidding...
Posted by: Willard Preacher | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:41 PM
Sickels does not consider Ethan Martin one of the Dodgers Top 20 prospects. BA has him at #17.
BA also rates their prospects according to chances of ever making the big leagues, which they call risk factors. The best rating is "safe" in that the player is so good he is a safe bet to actually see MLB time.
The highest risk level is "extreme" meaning that the player may have talent but is a real high-risk guy, a longshot to ever make the big leagues.
BA rates Martin "extreme."
Martin is repeating Double A at age 23 (not young for the level) and has improved his BB/9 which is his main problem. In doing so, however, his K/9 has declined a bit.
Martin throws a 95 mph fastball and a slider and changeup that he only occasionally can command.
I doubt he ever makes it, but if he does, it's likely as a bullpen guy.
Still, for a loaner like Vic, Lindblom & Martin are probably about as good as you can get.
Posted by: clout | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:41 PM
Yeah, I mean, this is obviously a salary dump. It's what most of us wanted them to do so they had cash free to make a run at some marquee FA's in the off-season.
But that return for Pence, if true, is unacceptable.
Posted by: Iceman | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM
Watch us make the playoffs after all.
Posted by: Chuck A. | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM
I don't think that Ruben is quite the master of retreats that Robert E. Lee was....
Posted by: GBrettfan | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM
Is there something so bad about Joseph that I'm missing?
Posted by: Kendrick Appreciation Society | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM
Pence for Terry Mulholland,JT Snow and Barry Bonds.
Vic for FP Santangelo and Eric Karros
Posted by: The Evil Ed Wade | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:42 PM
clout, not sure why you're down on Martin making it. As you stated, it sounds like he'd fit right the hell in!
"Martin throws a 95 mph fastball and a slider and changeup that he only occasionally can command."
Posted by: Willard Preacher | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:43 PM
Gelb: "Giants likely paying chunk of Pence's 2012 salary."
Oh, well then that makes it all worthwhile to me, the paying fan.
r00b better shock the hell out of me & go balls out in FA, or it's f*ck this noise for me.
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:43 PM
***I doubt he ever makes it, but if he does, it's likely as a bullpen guy.***
We are in complete agreement on Martin.
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:43 PM
Im pretty sure a straight dump without adequate youth return is not what we wanted.
Posted by: Five-4-One | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:43 PM
IF the Giants are taking all of Pence's salary, then I'm really happy with Tommy Joseph. I recognize that I'd be in the minority.
Here's a nice and fuzzy low-analytic article on him just for grins.
http://www.sfgate.com/sports/article/Giants-catch-winner-in-good-hitting-Tommy-Joseph-3393521.php
Posted by: Mick O | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:43 PM
I'm betting one of the redundant catchers now goes in a later move. They're practically the same guy at the same level. That's the only thing that makes sense.
Posted by: donc | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:43 PM
Rube did understand that he didnt have to trade Pence today, right?
It feels like he forgot that part.
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:44 PM
Do this mean Reggie Taylor and Lou Collier are being called up?
Posted by: The Evil Ed Wade | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:44 PM
KAS- the difference between Joseph and Brown is massive. We need a guy like Brown to improve our system, and he even fits a position of need going forward. As clout said last night, we have Joseph's clone (Valle) already in our system. It's not only a weak return, but redundant.
Posted by: Iceman | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:44 PM
Is there something so bad about Joseph that I'm missing?
He can't help the team at all right now?
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:45 PM
Maybe if this includes Blackburn and Panick it may not be so bad. With Nate S./Joseph included as well.
Posted by: Jimbo Jones | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:45 PM
Yo...new thread.
Posted by: NEPP | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:45 PM
Iceman, I think anyone advocating a "salary dump" methodology was also hanging their hat on getting some good young MLB READY prospects. As it's shaping up, next year will be the heavy duty payroll guys (Hamels, Paps, Doc, Lee, Howard) and a bunch of role players. It's going to look like the 2000-2001 Sixers with Iverson and a bunch of Raja Bells.*
*note 00-01 Sixers did make the NBA Finals...
Posted by: Willard Preacher | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:46 PM
I think the main knock on Joseph is that he has had a tough time adjusting to AA so far this season -- so this .667 of a season proves he's a stiff. That and BL wanted someone major-league ready... because we're sick and tired of Ruben Amaro planning for the times past 2013.
Posted by: Mick O | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:47 PM
I just got a funny mental image of an empty field, all our players having been traded for salary relief. And since we know RAJ can't get 100% salary relief on Howard, Utley, etc., we'd probably still have a $100 million payroll for that empty field.
Posted by: GBrettfan | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:47 PM
So now we have 3 nice catching prospects in the organization now? Joseph, Valle, Lino?
And oh yeah, a major league catcher still under team control for 1.5 years.
And Joseph can play first, which is great since we have a 1B being paid 25M for the next 100 yrs.
Posted by: Five-4-One | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:48 PM
Next year's OF will be Brown, Nix and Mini Mart?
Posted by: Willard Preacher | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:37 PM
Impossible. Mini-Mart will be playing 3rd base.
Posted by: Fatalotti | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:49 PM
I see salary dump all over the Pence move. But here's the reality. We can tout Pence's numbers, but he's been pretty mediocre this season. He's easily pitched to. His fielding is uneven. And he doesn't use his speed. So, what's the other GM going to give up to get him and his somewhat bloated salary? Not much.
Posted by: aksmith | Tuesday, July 31, 2012 at 12:51 PM