The Phillies received a capitol punishment at the hands of Washington Saturday and have lost nine of their last 11 meetings with the Nationals dating back to last season.
Beerleaguer: The Nats haven't won anything yet, but they're making believers out of Beerleaguer, the baseball world, and most importantly, themselves. From the postgame interviews: “I think everybody recognizes we’re for real,” said Nats first baseman Chad Tracy. “We know it. Now it’s just a matter of everyone else knowing it.” From manager Davey Johnson: “I think all we’re doing right now is reassuring that we can play with them (the Phillies).” Eighteen wins puts them 5.5 games ahead of the 13-15 Phillies, who fell to the National League East cellar once again since the rest of the division won Saturday. The Nats are 1.5 games in front of Atlanta.
That said, the Phils can salvage a 3-3 road trip tonight in prime time if Cole Hamels can outduel Jordan Zimmerman and if the offense can get back on track. The Phils also went 5-5 in their West Coast jaunt. They're 8-10 on the road and 5-5 at home. All anyone can ask is that they hover around .500, get healthy and stay healthy. Cliff Lee is due back Wednesday, and Ryan Howard and Chase Utley are reportedly making strides, specifically Utley. They're historically strong finishers, something the rest of the division knows nothing about .... yet.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/phillies/20120506_Inside_the_Phillies__Phillies__Ruiz_is_league_s_most_undervalued_player.html
Posted by: Scott | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 11:17 AM
The entire NL East has improved while the Phillies, due to age, injury, loss of offensive firepower has regressed. It's not going to the "easy" march to a play-off spot that some Phillie fans have grown accustomed to these last few years.
Posted by: Rich | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 11:46 AM
I would rather be an underdog. I think last year what killed the phillies were inflated expectations. Especially where Lee was concerned. That being said I listened to the whole game yesterday and it stabbed me in the heart. I throw up a little bit in my mouth when Schimmer is announced. The bull pen has officially eclipsed the batting as the biggest concern. We should be alright when the bats return, but unless our pen starts acting like professionals we could be doomed in october.
Paul M.
Posted by: Paul Moffitt | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 11:52 AM
Long season left--everyone thought the Pirates were "for real" last season too.
That said, I don't think anyone on here can deny that the two teams, in the longterm sense, appear to be heading in opposite directions.
Posted by: Jack | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 11:54 AM
I'm not convinced Utley can anymore be the kind of hitter the Phils need to make this line-up dangerous.
Posted by: Rich | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 12:03 PM
Not only are these two teams headed in the opposite direction, it looks like Hamels is going to accelerate the process by jumping ship. One questions whether the Phils can afford to add yet another mega contract (and remain competitive) anyway.
Posted by: curt | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 12:36 PM
I think when chase comes back offense will get back on track. Plus Howard to then at break the decisions will be made. Just last week nats lost 4 in a row. Win tonight and doc tomm with lee on wend.
Posted by: The hook | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 12:42 PM
I've seen enough. we are not as good as the Nationals and worse we are aging while they have not even come close to approaching their potential. The smart thing to do is trade away every high salary player over 30 for prospects and start from scratch.
Posted by: Thomas | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 01:01 PM
"The smart thing to do is trade away every high salary player over 30 for prospects and start from scratch"
...because this team would be much better over the next few years if we could just get rid of Lee, Halladay, Howard, & Papelbon.
Posted by: Dreamer | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 01:57 PM
The Nationals have a good young team and they play with a lot of energy. They are to be commended for turning their situation around because the franchise was a mess when it moved to DC from Montreal.
I think that the commentary about the Phillies has been right on point. There are a lot of home games in May. We'll have a better read on the situation on June 1 than we do now.
Posted by: Marc H | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 02:21 PM
Based on the last three threads the prevailing BL view is: Back up the truck, this team has no chance and it's time to start dumping vets for prospects.
Since BL prevailing wisdom is wrong nearly 100% of the time, I'm feeling pretty good about this team right now, if they can stay away from any more catastrophic injuries.
Posted by: clout | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 03:06 PM
There are precious few vets on this club who could be dumped for actual prospects. Maybe just 1; certainly no more than 3. And we've seen no evidence at all that Rube knows how to play that game anyway.
Posted by: curt | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 03:28 PM
Yeah ok and who is going tO take these (vets). Amazing how some people think you can just trade guys. The only guy they can trade is Cole. Plain and simple. No backing up truck etc. If only we get an 80 percent chase and Howard the team will be ok. Important stretch coming up. Mets pad and Astros. The team has lost five games in last at bat. So that tells me that they are close, but can't get over hump. I think chase and Howard can do that. Some scouts said that when chase has been taking BP they can hear the difference then last year. So maybe he plays first till Howard comes back.
Posted by: The hook | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 03:45 PM
Offensively LF, 3B, SS and 2B has been a void for the Phils this year. And still the Phils are pretty much a .500 team. They will be fine. Make the postseason and then anyhting can happen.
Posted by: Rich | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 03:50 PM
Clout: The team should be fine for this year if they get healthy. Trading for prospects is stupid.
That said, which team would you rather have for the next four seasons--the Phillies or the Nationals?
Posted by: Jack | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:00 PM
Rollins SS, Pierre LF, Victorino CF, Pence RF, Nix, 1B, Ruiz C, Polanco 3B, Orr 2B, Hamels P
Posted by: Bowlcut | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:08 PM
That said, which team would you rather have for the next four seasons--the Phillies or the Nationals?
Posted by: Jack
I'll go against the current on this one, but it's too early in the season to say.
Posted by: 3r0ck | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:17 PM
The Nats have followed the trail most recently blazed by the Rays: Suck for several years, use those top draft picks wisely, wait a few years and hope for the best.
Posted by: curt | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:19 PM
It's amazing how many folks just can't wait to write this team's obituary, especially with the season not even a quarter of the way over.
Posted by: Dragon | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:26 PM
Apparently, yesterday Jamie Moyer had words with Chipper because he believed him to be stealing signs from 2B.
* * * *
“I don’t know what the problem was,” Jones said. “I was literally having a conversation with the shortstop [Troy Tulowitzki] when he stepped off and said that. I don’t know why he’s so paranoid. But to be honest with you, every pitch he throws is 78 [mph]. So it’s not like we really have to relay signs.”
The AJC’s David O’Brien tweeted this afternoon that Chipper said Moyer is “paranoid” about sign stealing because he comes from a team, the Philies, that always does it.
* * * *
What is AJC? Are we really still believed to be sign-stealing? If we are stealing signs, it's not doing us much good.
Posted by: GBrettFan | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:53 PM
Paul technically the Phillies arent the underdogs...
Posted by: Luis | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:54 PM
GBrettFan: Atlanta Journal-Constitution. And the Phillies offense has taken a notable nose dive since a certain pair of binoculars were outlawed.
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:55 PM
Someone with a fastball really needs to put one in Larry's ear...
AJC is an Atlanta newspaper. Here's a link to a full story, filled with trash talk from Larry:
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/chipper-jones-jamie-moyer-accused-stealing-signs-162811837.html
Posted by: Scott | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:56 PM
And, why is it that our pitchers never seem to throw at other guys, when our players seem to get beaned an inordinate amount??
Posted by: Scott | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 04:59 PM
GTown: Thanks. I should have put that together myself.
Scott: Thanks for the link, which had some humorous commentary, like the possibility that Chipper accused Jamie of using Viagra or Geritol.
I do have to say, Chipper's retort that there's no need to steal signs when all Jamie's pitches are 78MPH did make me laugh.
But he's still a douchebag.
And, Scott, maybe our pitchers don't throw at other guys because they don't want to uncork the bottle of complaints about our sign-stealing. ;)
Posted by: GBrettFan | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 05:04 PM
Freeman got hit by a pitch in today's game. Larry isn't in the lineup. If I were the manager, I'd have the pitcher throw one in the dugout at him.
It occurs to me that I may have listened to too much Larry Andersen over the years, but someone needs to shut Chipper up.
Posted by: Scott | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 05:25 PM
Any word if tired, old Cholly will be on the bench tonight? We lost Goober Pyle earlier today and we're all hoping he can get back to Mayberry just as soon as possible. Aunt Bea is taking it really hard.
Posted by: Howard Sprague | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 05:32 PM
Believability Scale:
UFO
Crop Circles
The guy who wrote the Howard Hughes biography
The Runaway Bride who was abducted
Chad Tracy
-tie-
Larry Jones
Posted by: Raul's grandpa | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 05:38 PM
Q: When will fans realize that St. Utley is not the savior?
A: As soon as he returns to the lineup.
Posted by: Bert Wedemeyer | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 05:50 PM
Jack: If Ross Detwiler really is a 109 ERA+ SP (his career so far), then I'll take the Nationals.
I already know how good Strasburg, Gio and J. Zimmerman are.
As for offense, I'm not quite as impressed since R.Z. can't stay healthy, although they'll be a lot tougher when Morse gets back.
Bonus opinion: Wilson Ramos will be an All-Star catcher someday.
Posted by: clout | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 05:59 PM
Bert: One of his rehab exercises in Clearwater was walking on water.
Posted by: clout | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:03 PM
He also did something with a fish and some bread.
Posted by: Scott | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:05 PM
I was hoping to log on to see an entire thread header devoted to tonight's lineup. Polly dropped to 7, behind even the CATCHER???
Also, no Galvis again. I can't help but suspect that he may be on his way back to AAA sometime soon. And it would be the right move.
Someone please check to make sure Manuel is okay.
Posted by: Willard Preacher | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:18 PM
"We lost Goober Pyle earlier today"
I will miss the man.
Posted by: Rich | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:35 PM
If you switched Mayberry with Pierre and swap him out with Ruiz in the two spot, I would like that lineup.
Baby steps.
Posted by: Iceman | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:43 PM
Surprise, surprise, surprise.
Posted by: Pyle | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:44 PM
"Surprise, surprise, surprise."
He lives.
Posted by: Rich | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:46 PM
"That ain't my belly button"
"That ain't my finger, neither."
Posted by: Bert Wedemeyer | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 06:52 PM
Goober was born in either 1940 or 1941 (He says he was five years old when he was a witness to Floyd punching Charles Foley on August 9, 1946 in, "The Case of the Punch in the Nose.") He was raised in Mayberry, was trained as a mechanic in Raleigh, North Carolina, and served a stint in the North Carolina, National Guard where he picked up the phrase, "Yo." Goober worked at Wally's Filling Station, which he eventually purchased and became the proprietor of, later in the show's run. His girlfriend in four of the color episodes was Flora Malherbe, but his initial love interest was Lydia Crosswaithe, who was originally from Greensboro, North Carolina.
I suspect the "Yo" was established while Goober worked off a mob debt on Aramingo.
Posted by: Raul's grandpa | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:12 PM
I think the phils were too fast to pull the trigger that emptied out alot of quality pharm hands... i still think oswalt was an unneeded trade if we would have initially kept lee instead. and we paid too much for pence. --- when i think that we had gio g. in the phillies system and considered him a throw in for freddu garcia -- makes me ill--- it reminds me of the fergie jenkins and r.sandberg trades... equally stupid...
Posted by: lets eat | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:21 PM
...and as we head into the 17th in Beantown, two position players are now pitching...
Posted by: Scott | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:28 PM
Gio could have been had again this year too. They thought they could get John Deere to come back for peanuts on a one year deal.
Posted by: Raul's grandpa | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:33 PM
Phils won't get back the 20+ HR/.800 OPS Utley but they don't need him either.
The Phils' offensive numbers have been horrendous at 2B. Even if Utley is a .750-.770 OPS with a decent OBP, it would be a huge lift for this lineup.
It has been fun to watch Galvis defensively but he is a horrendous hitter even for his age. Just goes up there too many ABs without a real clue as to how he wants to approach it. Brutal hacker who chases slwo high in the zone, away, and low. The only pitch he has been able to handle effectively is stuff on the inside part of the plate and mistake pitches. Also baffling why someone of his stature swings so hard with 2 strikes.
With their starting pitching, the Phils don't need a dangerous lineup. They just need an adequate won that will put them in the middle of most NL categories. Do that and this team will win their share of games.
Posted by: MG | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:46 PM
We should probably wait to see if Gio makes the Hall before decided that trade was just as bad as the others mentioned ... but yeah, it was pretty awful. Not even bothering to give Garcia a physical was one of the all-time worst Phillies f-ups, & that's really saying something.
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:51 PM
"Always swing the bat hard, because you might hit the ball." - Yogi Berra.
Posted by: Scott | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:53 PM
Gomer couldn't hold a candle to Goober.
R.I.P. Goober Pyle.
The world lost a great one today.
Very good utility player too.
Posted by: Rich | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:56 PM
Gtown -- That was on Gillick's watch, no? How he did not get run out on a rail because of that flippin' Garcia trade? Astonishing; Ol' Pat must have had several million tons of political capital to burn.
Posted by: cut_fastball | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:58 PM
Nice interview with Bryce Harper. I was prepared to not like him based on some of the early impressions, but he seemed like a pretty decent guy, especially considering his age and the expectations.
Posted by: Bob | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 07:59 PM
cut_fastball: Yes, it was Gillick. I think the Phils going on to win the World Series helped his image significantly.
Posted by: GTown_Dave | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 08:09 PM
Wonderfull start in the top of the first.
Posted by: Bob | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 08:11 PM
Gtown -- The Series win did wonders! Heck, Pat's shout out to Ed Wade amidst the champagne shower was one of the most egalitarian gestures imaginable for a sports executive sitting on top of his chosen kingdom.
Is Mr. Gillick around anymore? Did he give his imprimatur to any of the RAJ moves over the last coupla' years? I wonder.
Posted by: cut_fastball | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 08:15 PM
Playoff hardened Phillies and all star pitcher schooled by the 19 year old rookie.
Posted by: Bob | Sunday, May 06, 2012 at 08:20 PM