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Thursday, March 15, 2012

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Doc's response:

“That’s poor reporting.The extreme end of poor reporting. It couldn’t be further from the truth.”

Ouch.

0-162

Season = over.

The absolute last thing I'd be worried about in spring training is Doc's velocity on MARCH 15TH(!) I'd rather spend my panic energy on the lack of a decent UTIF (praying Galvis excises the wart known as Mini-Mart).Not to mention Ty Stiffington. Is there any chance that trading Blanton brings back a starter-able 2B or SS? I figure Galvis can be the back-up to one of the two.

The Phillies have been on top for a long time, so there's going to be those that look for cracks in the armor. In this case it's the mysterious, "scouts from opposing teams" who should know better than to take spring training games too seriously if that's true at all. And famous bow tie model Ken Rosenthal who is one talking chair away from being Pee Wee Herman.

It's all stupid conjecture and will almost assuredly be forgotten in a few weeks.

I was at Doc's start in Lakeland last Friday. Eric Patterson was the only player in that lineup that hit Doc hard. Any hits off him were dinks and dunks or balls that found a hole in the infield. His location was spot on when he faced regulars like Austin Jackson and Fielder.

The fact that Doc said he had no feel for his changeup and wanted to work on that yesterday is a key point in this. How Rosenthal could leave out something like that in a story just shows that he wants to drum up business and page views rather than factual reporting.

Haven't seen the PANIC button graphic since it was run in about 10 consecutive posts in 2010. Ahh, memories.

Look, I understand the diminished velocity story is probably way overblown. But I'm not understanding why the panic police are telling everyone 'All is well!' with a guy who, if injured, would bring about the 2012 Phillies Apocalypse- when many were in the camp last spring who spent inordinate amounts of space lamenting the possible inclusion of Mini Mart as the 25th man on our roster.

Maybe I just don't get the whole 'When is it OK to panic?' thing because I haven't really worried about this team in quite a few seasons, but when a few red flags start going up about one of the three players the team absolutely cannot lose, I'm not sure why it's unacceptable to get a bit light-headed about it.

I call BS on Halladay here. He's right that it is poor reporting to speculate he is injured. That's no reason to jump to that conclusion.

However it is a fact that he was topping out at 89 MPH. That is not crappy reporting or idle speculation. IT IS FACT. Now maybe he was trying different arm slots that accounted for the 3-4 MPH drop in velocity. Quite possible. Doesn't mean it is irresponsible to report that unless suddenly reporting facts is verboten.

Willing to bet the Phils' training staff read those guns readings and grilled Halladay pretty hard after the game about how he was feeling though.

Time to panic a bit will be Halladay's last start in spring training when starters typically go at least 5 IP and treat it like a regular season game.

If Halladay is topping at 89 MPH then on his fastball, he is full of crap about 'working on arm angles' and he isn't 100%.

Remember when spring training was just spring training...

The Phillies will need momentum heading into the regular season, just like momentum is desperately needed heading into the playoffs. Time to start freaking out! :)

Rosenthal is a toadstool. I'd feel pretty safe betting that Halladay will be one of the few aspects of the '12 Phillies which doesn't suck.

Meanwhile, Laynce Nix -- another of r00b's patented "Why sign him for one season when I can waste money signing him for two seasons!" bench acquisitions -- is sitting out. Again.

Gtown - are you seriously pissing and moaning about $2.5 mill over two years? Wow dude. You need a hobby.


Has Halladay's velocity been down in all ST starts this year? I though he was sitting low 90s against the Tigers but stadium guns in minor league ballparks can't be trusted.

Last year, the fear was Cliff Lee's tilt. This year the fear is Roy Halladay's speed.

Next year, Vance Worley's glasses will be fogging up.

"are you seriously pissing and moaning about $2.5 mill over two years?"

I would flip that question around and ask: do you seriously believe that those who complain about the Laynce Nix signing are upset about the $2.5M salary figure? It's not the money. It's the opportunity cost of making a 2-year commitment to give one of 25 valuable roster spots to someone who sucks.

Doc - "Poor reporting on the extreme end of poor reporting. It couldn’t be further from the truth."

Did all of the reporters around Halladay wet themselves out of fear for their lives?

Last year, Eskin tried to make a story out of Doc not talking to reporters. Same stuff with this story. Just leave Doc alone to take care of business.

Spring training was just spring training when the players were young. They are not anymore, and great concern over the health of players at their age is quite appropriate.

BAP - Don't you think you should at least see what Nix can do this year before proclaiming that he sucks? For $1.25 million, that player can be released and the salary implications are minimal without any lasting effects.

And I would also argue that of all people Gtown_Dave is not in the least bit concerned with opportunity cost. Considering that he said he wanted an upgrade from Ben Francisco and then couldn't come up with a player who was better, I don't think opportunity cost crossed his mind.

Beware (panicking about meaningless Spring Training performances and rumors based on stupid stuff and unproveable facts on) the Ides of March.

"Don't you think you should at least see what Nix can do this year before proclaiming that he sucks"

Ah, you're breaking out the old Pedro Feliz argument. "Sure, the guy has been playing major league ball for over a decade and has a .288 career OBP over 1800 PAs but, since none of those 1800 PAs came as a member of the Phillies, we have no basis for rendering an opinion on whether he's any good."

This kind of story & its reaction is what I hate about the Internet. It encourages all kind of ridiculous speculation and then there is an inevitable backlash against that ridiculous speculation. Churn is so quick now that most things don't last more than 48 hrs though.

Several reporters simply stated that Halladay's velocity was notably down yesterday from his normal range where has been for years. That's all. It is a basic fact.

If Halladay got all bothered and steamed about that particular issue, then he is kind of a dick. Just reporters doing their job relaying information on something that factually occured.

I am sure if Halladay hadn't gotten hit hard it wouldn't have been an issue but he did and reporters simply stated something that happened.

Pissing and moaning about the backup catcher, backup to the backup utility man and the 5th outfielder is funny queer, not funny ha-ha.

If he fills the role that is designed for him, spot starter/LH bat off the bench, why not see what he can do before going all Mini-Mart on him? It's not like he is holding anyone back from taking his spot.

Unless of course he starts to get the majority of the starts in LF, then my argument is null and void.

MG, it's not the reporting of the facts that rattles cages, it's the speculation based upon a single fact, completely devoid of context.

His velocity was down, ok?

Maybe he didn't throw many 4-seamers yesterday, or maybe the gun was off, or maybe he was working on several arm-slots, or different grips with his pitch, or maybe he wasn't feeling well yesterday, or maybe the gun is off.

You act like the reporter handed his editor a napkin with, "Halladay's velocity on fastball lower than it normally is", and that was the end of it.

Of course, though, the real fact is that reporters saw a low velocity in ST, and began SPECULATING that there may be something wrong with Halladay. And that's what Halladay got upset about.

"It encourages all kind of ridiculous speculation and then there is an inevitable backlash against that ridiculous speculation."

On Beerleager, the cycle goes as follows: (1) vague, unspecified report on some sketchy website; (2) ridiculous speculation on Beerleaguer; (3) backlash against ridiculous speculation; (4) backlash against the backlash to the ridiculous speculation; (5) backlash against the backlash against the backlash to the ridiculous speculation; (6) backlash against the backlash against the backlash against the backlash to the ridiculous speculation; (7) clout weighs in and calls one of the sides idiots (the posts, that is; not the posters); (8) backlash against clout; (9) backlash from clout against the backlash against clout; (10) people asking jw for new threads; (11) more backlash, and backlash to the backlash, etc.; (12) new vague, unspecified report on some sketchy website; (13) new thread, regarding vague, unspecified report on some sketchy website; (14) repeat steps 1 through 13.

JW, shouldn't it be a "Phanic" button?
___________________________________________________________________

I'll worry about Halladay if and when it's time to worry.
__________________________________________________________________

As far as Nix is concerned, he was brought in to platoon in LF and be a LHB off the bench. If Mayberry proves that he can continue hit RHP as well as he did last season, then IMO there might not even be a platoon after a while, and especially if Howard is effective after he returns. Charlie will want Mayberry's defense and baserunning on the field.


Mayberry, 2011, vs. RHP:

.250/.330/.455, 176 PA


Nix, lifetime vs RHP:

.253/.296/.451, 1584 PA

2011:

.263/.306/.475, 320 PA


Nix may have to put up the kind of numbers he did in 2011 vs. RHP to get the playing time.

Still, Nix is the more "proven" commodity against RHP, so it's Mayberry who has to prove that 2011 is repeatable.


"Several reporters simply stated that Halladay's velocity was notably down yesterday from his normal range where has been for years. That's all. It is a basic fact."


MG, now I'm calling "BS" on you.

If all the reporter did was note that his velocity was down, it would be one thing. But Rosenthal started out his piece this way:

"Et tu, Roy Halladay?

The physical troubles of Philadelphia Phillies first baseman Ryan Howard and second baseman Chase Utley are well documented."


If that's not a clear implication that Halladay might be injured, what is?

So, the FACT is that he was more than simply implying that injury might have something to do with it, and Halladay said that that it was BS.

Nice try at revisionist history, MG. Your problem is that the history is in black and white and it ain't that old.

"Several reporters simply stated that Halladay's velocity was notably down yesterday from his normal range where has been for years. That's all. It is a basic fact."

I know you're not this simple-minded MG. He was p*ssed about the speculation, not about the actual reporting. Rosenthal's article was ripe with speculation.

Nevermind, I just basically repeated what Fata and awh had already said.

"I know you're not this simple-minded MG. "


Iceman, are you SURE of that?

After all, the FACT is that MG did post that on the website for all of us to see. That's all. Simple basic fact.

And people have called him on it.


So, "If [MG] got all bothered and steamed about that particular issue, then he is kind of a dick. Just [other posters] doing their job relaying information on something that factually occured."

Since it's a day of speculation, Murph does some of his own about today's lineup:

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/phillies/Should-we-read-anything-into-todays-line-up-against-the-Braves.html

Who manages split squad games? UC stays in Clearwater. Does Sandberg take the reins for the other game?

"I call BS on Halladay here. He's right that it is poor reporting to speculate he is injured. That's no reason to jump to that conclusion."

That's what I said. I did think Rosenthal's piece was a bit too speculative and lead readers to believe that Halladay was definitely injured. It was too far a conclusion to reach given the weak evidence from a single outing where Halladay got hit hard.

It is quite possible Halladay is hurt and not 100%. A drop of 3-4 MPH on a fastball is not typical for a guy who has been consistently at 92-93 for the past several years even in spring training.

Not enough evidence to really speculate on that though until you have more direct evidence. You won't know until a few more starts in spring training especially the last one.

Like I said before, if Halladay at the same velocity in his last tuneup start then Halladay isn't 100% regardless of what he publicly says. Happens all the time with players and how healthy they are feeling. Especially pitchers. Issue that bears some attention.

I got the sense that Halladay was pissed at the entire story including the report out the dip in velocity. That's all.

Bap - so true about B lol

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