Phillies

Transactions & Such

Winter leagues

Part of CSNPhilly.com


« | Main | Poll: Who should replace Victorino on the roster? »

Thursday, May 19, 2011

Comments

Maybe Dane Sardinha has a brother who plays CF.

Just look at the AAA roster and figure out which OF has the worst offensive stats but a good "reputation" for defense regardless of the reality.

That's who they'll pick.

And w/ the announcement that both Vic & Blanton are headed to the DL, r00b tacitly admits he didn't merely screw the pooch, he f*cked the damn thing silly. Love how he's not gonna bring Brown up, though. Nope, this Phillies' Offense doesn't need any help at all, what w/ how freakin' awesome the AAA rejects have been. I know it's true 'cause Scott Proefrock told TMac & Wheels so.

He screwed that pooch and then tossed it in the oven at 450. Can't possibly bring up Brown, the #4 prospect in baseball who was expected to be the starting RF coming into the year anyway. Clearly he needs another few years in the minors. We have ZERO legit guys in AAA other than him. Its Rich Thompson or Brandon Moss or maybe even the great Delwyn Young.

The groundhog saw its shadow and that means 6 more weeks of Michael Martinez.

Shane going on the DL? Oy.

Old Phan: Retroactive to yesterday. Because the Phillies can't possibly learn that PLAYERS WHO ARE INJURED SHOULD BE PLACED ON THE DAMN DL.

The best part of last night's decision is that Cole is a pretty good bunter so there was absolutely ZERO reason to PH for him anyway.

Also, why the hell do you wait 5 days to get an MRI anyway. 1-2 days is one thing, 5 is just stupid. Now we lose him for a minimum of 20 days overall and likely more knowing his history of hamstring issues. Good thing we have zero depth at key positions like middle infielders and CF.

NEPP: It's OK. With DeBarge in the 2 spot, how can the Phillies possibly lose? And he's such a good fielder, too!

This team is worse than the Mets now when it comes to dealing with injuries.

I assumed that it was a minor injury and that he wouldn't end up on the DL. Very strange turn of events.
Honestly, I'm not as worked up about Blanton, however.

I thought last year's offensive slumps were bad. I can't believe this is our worst offensive slump in decades. It's not just bad, it's monumentally bad.

This is easily the worst regular lineup we've had since the late 90s.

I keep expecting us to sign Danny Tartabull or bring back Travis Lee.

DeBarge. Good call. I thought Martinez was Snoop from The Wire.

Brad Lidge used to be an OF. Maybe he can pitch in every once in a while. He hasn't touched a bat in years, of course, but then, he might just fit right in.

Blanton clearly belonged on the DL...wouldnt be surprised if surgery was in his future.

Vic never should have been in the game yesterday if this was even a possibility. Brown may not be ready, but theres no better option right now.

This team clearly still needs another OF bat. And I heard that Utley will be up early next week; anyone else know anything about this?

NEPP, Charlie said last night after the game that Cole had problems bunting against a lefty. I dont know if thats true or not but that is what he said.

Who else is there in AAA. Its basically Dom Brown or career AAAer Rich Thompson (who is at least playing pretty well). Just brutal really.

Charlie just said that it was between Shane and Oswalt to bunt last night. Shane said he was fine.

Good thing UC listened to Shane over his training staff who has been rehabbing his leg for the last week.

Brilliant managerial decision there.

I think the way this team has handled injuries and roster spots has been an absolute disgrace.

Inexcusable. Arrogance, or incompetence?

Amaro is chock full of sh*t!

Oswalt would have made a lot more sense anyway as he's a better bunter than Shane anyway.

Not being a doctor, nor playing one on TV, I would like to know why they waited for the MRI on Shane. I can understand not wanting to put him on the DL if it wasn't necessary, but the whole thing seems weird.

Charlie did say that had he known Shane was injured to the extent he was, he'd not have used him to bunt. Apparently Vic & Blanton both claimed to feel well enough to play (well, until Blanton's BP tonight), in spite of MRIs showing otherwise.

Yeah, this does smack of the '08 Mets, or was it '09? Or both. Ugh, I hope we aren't headed for their fate.

Free Rich Thompson!

NEPP: no, you are misinformed. Mike Martinez can play the middle infield AND centerfield. That's why he's on the team in the 1st place.

I'm starting to think we are, GBrettfan. We're basically at critical mass on injuries at this point.

Marv - Arrogance in spades. It really pisses me off how Amaro responds and refuses to answer even legit questions that aren't inflammatory or foolish.

All I know is if I was a board member, I would cringe when I saw him speak on nights like this to the media & wonder how his act will play in the future when this team inevitably takes a step or two back in the next few years.

As for the Blanton thing, all signs point to incompetence unless there is something that medical staff/trainers goofed up on.

So with Blanton out for the foreseeable future, I guess we'll get Kendricked a lot, huh?

seriously who are they calling up???

I don't know if the rest of you have looked at this lineup, but it is terrible. 1/2 of it is composed of automatic outs.

NEPP: Is that why we so many of us freak out? Because we have a fear of not realizing the potential of our 4 great starters, due to injury and really bad offense?

Old Phan - It is. Talking to the CMO where I work today and he said there is absolutely no reason you wait 5 days to use an MRI to get a substantial diagnosis on a muscle injury. At the most, it is 36 hrs.

Somebody on the training or medical staff is f@cking up and not getting the job done. My bet is that the Blanton goof is going to be an incredibly costly one to the tune of his salary this year and next.

I assume Worley is back up with Blanton down again.

So that's a plus...never should have sent him down.

Dom Brown is the only OF on the 40 man roster who isn't already in the Majors. They have to make a roster move if they want to bring anyone else up.

I loved the one reporter's question to UC: "Are you embarrassed by your offense?"

Did UC answer "No"?

If he did, did the reporter then say, "Well, you SHOULD be"

Worley for Blanton and a life sized autograghed Willie Mays cardboard cutout in basket catch position for Vic

Re: jbird

It's like the old Bell-Lieberthal-Pitcher inning! Except now we have 2 of those innings!

"Are you embarrassed by your offense?"

That is the kind of foolish question that I wouldn't expect Cholly or Amaro to answer or to get short about.

I wonder if Mays could still hack it at CF...he's only 80.

BROWN HAS THE FOLLOWING LINE: .378/.442/.689, 1.131 OPS, 4 HR, 10 RBI, 11 RS, 9 SO, 5 BB in 52 plate appearances including CLR. He has a 16 game hitting streak that goes back to 2010 with LHV where he batted .327 with 20 HR.

I would like to give the FO the benefit of the doubt. the problem is that most likely we'll never know the whole story.

I wonder what this team will look like in 2012 if Rollins doesn't come back.

Victorino
Polanco
Utley
Howard
Brown
Mayberry/Francisco
Ruiz
Valdez
(pitcher)

The good old days of the Phillies being an offensive threat have passed. The scoring of past few weeks isn't the new norm, but it's closer to the norm than 2007-2009.

Clearly, Dom Brown is not ready and they'd rather make a 40 man roster move to call up a AAA filler piece instead.


Phils have to just ride this thing out until they get some help back (Vic, Contreras, Utley) but it is going to be a rocky road at best.

No off-days over the next 2 weeks (June 2nd is the next off-day) don't help one bit.

Fortunately for me, my better half forgot to record the game for me - until the 6th ining. Apparently, I'll see no scoring.

Only question: why the F did Victorino pinch-bunt yesterday if they were unsure of his health? Just a ridiculous F up. Unbelievable.

Everyone remember a few days ago when Victorino and the Phils all said he was fine and just needs a few days? Won't see him until mid June I bet.

1-0 arizona....the braves are not exactly lighting up the scoreboards either...

There is no set timetable for how you do MRI's. If you aren't there looking at it firsthand then you are doing nothing but guessing.

On the roster moves- Worley definitely comes back up now. On the second person it may be another pitcher or the illustrious Brian Bocock.

Bocock is the only 40 man roster move available. He would have the benefit of giving us 4 SS in a single lineup.

So we'd never ever ever have to worry about that ever dreadful Lose 3 SS in a single game injury scenario.

Besides Dom Brown can anyone name a single hitting prospect in AA or AAA? A real prospect who might actually be useful to the team. Maybe the current draft strategy of only drafting pitchers and toolsy outfielders who can't actually hit isn't working so hot. Lonnie Chisenhall (instead of Hewitt) sure would look good right now.

Calling up Brown right now from Rube's perspective:

- Brown hasn't had that many ABs at Lehigh (only 41 in 11 G coming into tonight)
- Just coming of an injury himself
- Intense spotlight on Brown to instantly produce
- Brown didn't handle the spotlight all that well that year when he got called up
- Brown is an asset they are counting on to be productive for the long-term and don't want to jeopardize that
- Phils f@cked up when they called him up last year and likely retarded his development a bit

I can see why people want Amaro to call up Brown but there are really strong reasons why he might not want to right now. Throwing a kid in the pressure cooker who didn't exactly respond last year to it.

D-Backs have a good one in Collmenter. Jurrjens giving up some big flys this inning.

We dont have any other hitting prospects in the upper minors.

Moss? Larish? Sullivan?

Will: Yes it clearly makes sense to make that pronouncement about the glory days of the offense passing when our true starting line-up have not played one game together this year. As I've said numerous times- let's wait and see what the line-up looks like in mid-June once guys are healthy. The line-up I believe you see then is exactly the same line-up you have for 2012 with Valdez in for Rollins.

Jay: Exactly. Like I said, even if we slip out of first the Braves and Marlins are not good enough to run away from the Phillies.

Amaro: "The MRI on Victorino revealed a Grade 1 / Grade 2 hamstring strain, he's likely to go on the DL

Scotchman- I bet Vistorino's dead and they dumped the body in the Atlantic.

now 2-0 arizona...

"There is no set timetable for how you do MRI's. If you aren't there looking at it firsthand then you are doing nothing but guessing."

This is 100% wrong. Hell this isn't an organization looking to hold down expensive imaging costs or might get a hassle from a medical insurer about an unnecessary image test.

There is no reason to wait 5 days until doing an initial MRI to diagnosis the extent of an injury to a player who has a notable and frequent history of leg muscles problems.

Someone on the Phils' training staff/medical staff f@cked up. That simple.

Michael Martinez is batting .194 with a .431 OPS. He will be our 2 hole hitter for the forseeable future because Rube wont make a roster move and UC thinks he's versatile and fast.

If they call up Bocock, I dont think I'll bother watching.

Looking ahead to next year they are going to have a little bit of cash under the hood to play with. Currently they are at 112 million. Hypothetically let's put Hamels at 15 a year and Madson at 10. That gets you to 137 with about 28 million to you get to where they are right now.

From there it's really a decision on Rollins and then bench guys.

"Scotchman- I bet Vistorino's dead and they dumped the body in the Atlantic."

and Brown will be at the ballpark tomorrow

NEPP - That's Cholly foolishness to continue to insist hitting Mini Mart 2nd.

F you Ruben Amaro. Is there any conceivable excuse for Victorino not being diagnosed sooner and being used to fukking BUNT before they determined how seriously he was hurt? Total fukk up.

As long as Mini Mart is back, I'll be happy.

Am i the only one who thinks ryan should get the day off tomorrow?

As far as I can tell, he's had a full week off...what's one more day.

I see the Phils exceeded their limit of 5 hits. Probably need to give one back tomorrow.

"Yes it clearly makes sense to make that pronouncement about the glory days of the offense passing when our true starting line-up have not played one game together this year."

The frequency of DL stints since the start of the 2010 season is reason enough to pronounce an end to the glory days of Phillies offense.

The loss of Werth, the three year decline (and possible loss) of Rollins, the steep decline and loss of Ibanez are three other decent reasons.

If and when Utley plays a full season without playing hurt or landing on the DL, and if and when Domonic is the offensive juggernaut that BL has promised me he will become, we may come within sniffing distance of the end of the last decade.

Seriously, there were two (possibly three) major screw ups concerning injuries and they all happened around the same time. Some heads gotta roll.

Manuel: "Right now, we're bad, but we've got to get better"

Playing Vic last night was stupid bit he probably needs a few weeks to mend anyway making the five days retro meaningless.

MG: It's not 100% wrong I don't give a damn what your CMO is telling you. Normally you would take an MRI within the first 48 hours, but that's not a hard and fast rule. I'm not looking at the possible swelling personally, neither are you, neither is your CMO. The medical staff for the Phillies is. I'm not saying 5 days is the norm.

It's possible that they tested the range the following day and saw nothing that necessitated an MRI. After a few days Vic complained of continued discomfort and they decided to MRI then. That's not negligently treating the injury which is what you are accusing them of. It's going off information. I mean if your CMO is able to diagnose the injury from miles away and without looking at it firsthand then he is in the wrong business. He should set up a 1-800 healing number and just have people from all over the country call him.

Truth Injection: Incidentally, how many games did our "true lineup" play together last season?

Seems to be a continuing trend...

What the hell is going on with this team? This line-up was set to fail from the start. Too many lefties, too old, too impatient at the plate, and so on. Francisco is now exposed for what he really is which is a career bench player not a substitute for Jason Werth. Raul Ibanez is about ready to play with the Field of Dreams guys playing in that corn field in Iowa (maybe he could get a hit off of Moonlight Graham). Uncle Charlie is exposed for the manager he is or should I say isn't (let's put a injured player up to bunt risking further injury and costing him another week out of the line-up because his DL stint could have been made retroactive to last week when he last played until the pinch bunt assignment). Come on Rube, time to do something. We are blowing way too many well pitched games because we don't have the sticks. Make a move for a good hitting corner outfielder before it's too late!!! Shake it up baby!

Fire GG

Will: So everything before Saturday when we started the losing streak should just be chalked up to the offense showing the old adage of blind squirrels finding nuts?

i get the feeling that if we were winning games this week 2-1 you wouldn't be making that same post.

BloodStripes - somehow the thought that Vic needs more than 15 more days to heal didn't make me feel better but, I thank you just the same.

Will: By this time last season they had played considerably more games together than they have played so far this year.

TTI - The swelling would go down enough after 24 hrs to do an MRI. Fine, they didn't do an MRI initially but then they f@cked up the initial diagnosis.

Either way, the training staff (likely the medical staff) didn't get the job done.

Yes it clearly makes sense to make that pronouncement about the glory days of the offense passing when our true starting line-up have not played one game together this year.

And I ask once again: What happens if the Phillies' "true" starting lineup is never available to play a game together? It is entirely possible -- not probable, but possible -- that the Phillies could injure themselves out of the race. That's the danger of carrying an old roster, & the necessity of having better than the most abysmal of backup options ... or, you know, maybe actually using the "untouchable" prospect who isn't learning sh*t at the AAA level. The Phillies are built to win NOW, & ought to begin acting as such.

MG: My point is this. Maybe they did screw up the initial diagnosis, and maybe they didn't. They do tests on that stuff. Vic may have indicated no discomfort on the hamstring so they let the swelling go down and monitored it. At some point after that he may have tweaked it or continued to feel discomfort and then they decided to do an MRI.

My point is I don't know because I wasn't there- but neither were you. I'm sure there are things the medical staff has done wrong but this may or may not be one of them. I don't think they are being negligent though like you seem to be accusing them of.

Professional athletes lying about / minimizing their injuries? Say it ain't so, Joe.

Easy to blame the medical staff, but they don't make roster decisions. Rube isn't coming out of this month smelling like roses.

GTown: That absolutely may be true but you can't just assume that happens and use it as rationale for your argument.

Also, even if the full team doesn't play together often this season- I don't expect the team to go through this funk the rest of the year. They were essentially doing fine until they left Florida. They've had a terrible 9 days offensively. That is going to happen in a season- it happened last year, and in 2009, and in 2008, etc.

I reject the notion though that the glory days are behind them because they are trotting out a lineup that includes a mix of Valdez/Orr/Martinez with guys like Ruiz struggling. You and Will think that will happen all year long and I don't- guess we will find out.

"By this time last season they had played considerably more games together than they have played so far this year."

What, five games? Six?

Dave has it right: there isn't a lot of reason to believe that their "true" lineup is going to take the field very often.

Their true lineup minus Werth, minus a productive Ibanez and possibly minus Rollins next season and with an unknown quantity in Mayberry and Brown.

The days of the Phillies as an offensive threat are over, and with the budget taken up in the rotation, they're not coming back any time soon. They're aging. They have no money to spend. Get used to the Ben Francisco's and Pete Orr's because you're not going to see the 25-30 HR throughout the lineup in this era of Phillies baseball. It's going to be Ryan Howard and a lineup around where we hope for the best.

Will: It was considerably more than 6 and you know that. I know you hate facts though.

As I said to Dave- it may turn out that they hit like crap the rest of the year but I'd be willing to bet that isn't going to be the case.

I YI YI YI
your father re-fills cream donuts
and
Your sister ride-a bicycle with no seat

The wailing and gnashing of teeth here always makes me feel optimistic. Don't worry, I'll be eating innings again soon.

Joe: I wish you'd bring as much to the table as you've eaten off of it in the past few years.

"It was considerably more than 6 and you know that. I know you hate facts though."

Well, defend your argument and let's see your facts. How many games did the regular lineup start in 2010? Do you believe that this number will be higher or lower in 2011?

I love how the guy who's best quality is that he's an "innings eater" is the least able man in the rotation to pitch deep into the game.

Hey Dave, eat this UU====>

well both fla and atlanta lose.....

give mick his binoculars back

Will: The Phillies played 16 times with the opening day line-up. They played 8 games with the opening day line-up but with Schneider in for Ruiz to give him a day off.

They played 24 games with the opening day line-up but Valdez in place of Rollins. They played 15 times with the opening day line-up but with Castro in place of Rollins.

This year they've played as many games with 2 regulars missing as they've played with the opening day line-up, a line-up that doesn't include Utley. As I've continually said as well- my guess is that by the middle of June- Brown is up and starting at one of the corner outfield spots which moves probably Ben Fran to the bench. That's the line-up I think maximizes the team the best, and it's basically they line-up you have for 2012 with Valdez in place of Rollins.

The injuries an other bad things happening are almost of Biblical height. Baseball gods are pissed. Why isnt he going to call up Brown? Was there a logical reason for this. I guess you can put Gload an Mayberry up there. I like Gload he has a good bat. We will drop in the standings an then try an make a race in the last 60 games. I hope we can pull it out.

"I don't know if the rest of you have looked at this lineup, but it is terrible. 1/2 of it is composed of automatic outs."

Worse still, that has actually been the more productive half of our lineup over the last 10 days.

Let me get this straight. We've averaged 3 runs a game for the entire month of May, are missing our 2 best all-around players, are near the bottom of the league in runs scored, and are trotting out 2 to 3 starters per game from the group comprised of Valdez, Orr, Martinez, and Sardinha. Neither of our starting corner outfielders is hitting above .225, and neither has an OPS anywhere close to .700. Our rosters at AA and AAA are filled with minor league retreads at literally every position, save for one blue chip RF prospect who's the 4th ranked prospect in all of baseball & is hitting .341 with a .968 OPS, after hitting .327 with a .980 OPS across 2 levels last year. And we're not gonna call this guy up? Then who exactly ARE we gonna call up? Brian Bocock? Corey Sullivan? Delwyn Young?

I get that, in a perfect world, the Phillies would prefer to keep Brown at AAA for awhile longer. But there's simply no viable alternative. This team is the worst offense in the major leagues right now -- and there isn't even a close 2nd. Is RAJ really planning to call up yet another non-hitting retread who would make the offense even worse?

I don't believe it. Unless Amaro has a trade up his sleeve, and it's ready to go down within the next 48 hours or so, he'll sleep on this & conclude that Domonic Brown is the only option. It's inconceivable to me that he could reach any other conclusion.

Actually, I guess there is one other viable call-up candidate besides Brown. I should have scoured the roster of Clearwater. Turns out, they have a pretty highly regarded 2nd baseman on their roster. David Hale, at Delaware Online, speculates that he could actually be the call-up. It would be earlier than the Phillies had planned but desperate times call for desperate measures. And right now their offense is nothing, if not desperate.

I love how much we complain and claim season=over when we're 1GB best record in baseball.

The comments to this entry are closed.

EST. 2005

Top Stories

HardballTalk

Rotoworld News

SHOP CSN


Advertisements


Follow on Twitter

Follow on Facebook

Contact Weitzel

CSG