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Tuesday, August 24, 2010


Let's go Schwim!

The only catch with these guys is that even if Rube brings them up (and the FO seldom brings up very many guys), Chollie would rather pitch the same four guys to death (in this case Durbin, Contreras, Madson and Lidge) than use, say, a LH kid against a LHB.

Heather 3:25 post: "I do think baseball and society have gotten softer."

Now, continuing with the "JW should be benched, fined, possibly given outright release, tarred (and naturally feathered immediately thereafter)" debate...

GTown Dave: I understand, but the clamoring should be for Vic to sit vs. RHP in favor of Dom, not Werth.

UC doesn't seem to have much confidence in non-veterans. Whether that's because of an UC hangup or because our AAA pitchers suck is anybody's guess.

No truth to the rumor that Chollie opted for the alternative punishment of having Werth read through the last thread over benching him tonight.

No mention of Cody "The Answer" Ransom or Matt "The Savior" Rizzotti?

The Mathieson angle is quite interesting. If this kid can learn the splitter, he could be a dangerous weapon. Hell, I'd sit Madson down with him and show him how to grip the changeup.

I have to admit, I'd much rather see Romero than Zagurski come out to face a LH PH that the opposing manager is gonna pull for a...

No I wouldn't. No matter how bad Zagurski is, he wouldn't be the 2010 version of JC vs. RHBs.

clout, you should know better. Once Lights Out Mathieson is up, there's no need for any additional offense. The BL concensus is that he's a non-PED aided version of Gagne at his peak.

clout (You're forgetting John "the Stud" Mayberry), We all know you'd love to see Rizzotti come up for a September game or too just so you could crow after he was overmatched by some major league breaking stuff. Admit it: you'd love to watch that particular train wreck.

Andy: "Chollie would rather pitch the same four guys to death (in this case Durbin, Contreras, Madson and Lidge) than use, say, a LH kid against a LHB."

Are you talking about Antonio "The Next Santana, Better Than Hanson" Bastardo?

I agree with you. What could possibly go wrong?

And if Cody Ransom is the "Answer," I can't imagine how effing stupid the question must be.

"UC doesn't seem to have much confidence in non-veterans. Whether that's because of an UC hangup or because our AAA pitchers suck is anybody's guess."

Heather, I would go with the first of your two options, especially when it comes to pitchers. Although, I would say "preference" rather than "hangup" IMHO.

WP: We already have a Lights Out. We need a M nickname to go with Mathieson.

"What could possibly go wrong?"

I know you have a man-crush on Romero, so I apologize for hurting your feelings.

Andy: Your post perfectly encompasses the awful truth. Charlie is dumb as a sea cucumber when it comes to managing pitchers. If it ain't in his "book" (which I envision as being sparely worded but brightly illustrated, perhaps in a Seussian manner, albeit somewhat less busy, so as not to distract), he can't fathom doing it.

CJ: That's a fair point. I'd rather have Vic's speed in CF, though. Nobody hits when Cole is pitching, anyway, so a Web Gem might just be key to victory.

WE could always use Pessylvania Dutch terminaology for Mathieson:
"Make the Laghts Aught" Mathieson.

I guess there's no arm in teaching the splitter to Mathieson. I hear it's a pitch that puts a lot of stress on the arm.

BAP, you mentioned your HS baseball coach on the last thread. Just a quick question, were you born and raised in the Philly/Eastern PA area only to relocate to the Bay Area, or are you a West Coast native that somehow came to follow the Phils (and if so, how the hell did that happen?; they ARE the losingest franchise in professional sports, after all).

Just curious.

WP: My policy is to give nicknames based on Beerleaguer poster comments calling for various minor leaguers to be brought up because "they'd certainly be better than (insert name of slumping major league player here.)"

Scott Meltdown Mathieson?

Andy: No, "Outen the Lights" Mathieson.

Scott "Welcome back! You can sit over there, next to Baez. What? Yes, I realize that's the CBP bus lot. Now shut up & go!" Matheison?

G-Town - I'm not that far gone on Chollie, though. There is a strong element of truth to what clout is alluding to as well. The reason Chollie sticks with the same four guys is that no one else is truly capable. The onlt reason I'd go with Zagurski or Bastardo would be for platoon match-up reasons. Hell, I'd be tempted to pull them after one pitch if the opposing manager switched out for a RHB.

But it has been frustrating to see opposition managers throw relief pitcher after relief pitcher at the Phils in September because they're not afraid to use them up (cause they have a very full bullpen) while the Phils wear the same few guys down.

sophist: Exactly right. In fact, so many pitchers hurt their arms throwing the splitter most organizations steered their prospects away from it.

clout - Thanks. Right. That woulda worked better for Outman I suppose.

And Moose was taken by Mattair...

No mention of Greg "I'll hit more HRs than Ross Gload" Dobbs either?

I like "Outen the Lights." But save it for Schwimer since he's from the right area.

Scott "I'm no Christy" Matheison?

phaithful: Wrong. JW has Dobbs listed.

Andy: I tend to wonder what goes on in Charlie's thick skull when he brings in Romero to face a LHB, watches in apparent amazement as the opposing team PH a RHB, & then leaves JC in to face certain doom. I believe he did this 2 nights in a row recently. I also wonder why he'd leave Durbin to throw 30-odd pitches in a game the Phillies were losing by 7 runs rather than let the aforementioned (prior post) Bye-Bye-Baez mop up. There's both a time to go w/ the "capable" relievers, & a time to let the dregs have at it for the longer term greater good of the 'pen. Charlie doesn't appear to have any clue which is which.

None of the Sept callups are going to pitch at all unless they see some action during the doubleheader makeup vs. the Fish during Labor Day.

Despite the risk of people insulting me 18 years from now because i proclaimed Mathieson the next Mariano Rivera - I still am an advocate for Mathieson to see time out of the pen for the MLB club. A low cost closer would do absolute wonders for this team and tis payroll - I think this team needs to really find a way to get a power arm developed for the 9th inning for years to come. Mathieson is an option right now in my mind if they can get him some work in the bigs.

"Last night's blunder was obviously a result of not having his head in the game. But it's simply dishonest to lump that play in with the other times he has been picked off, & call him a repeat offender.

Posted by: bay_area_phan | Tuesday, August 24, 2010 at 03:54 PM

Werth getting picked off, OTOH, was inexcusable.

Posted by: bay_area_phan | Thursday, August 05, 2010 at 10:16 PM "

How soon we forget.

Frankly I kinda like the idea of getting some September call-up playing time for Anthony "the Next D'Arby "the Next Greg "the Next Timothy "the Next Chris "the Next Jeff Jackson" Roberson" Moss" Golson" Myers" Hewitt.

Um, uh, there's no reason to use the young guys. They can, (clear throat) sit around and uh, um, learn the system. Time is yours.

Scott "Mariano" Mathieson. I like it.

He's allowed to drink the coffee, right?

Speaking of nicknames, any update on Ross "Bionic Groin" Gload?

Mariano Mathieson!! I love it. Appropriate, since the prevailing wisdom is that despite the lack of the movement, his 98 mph heat will make him one of the most dominant closers of all time.

Because he was really good at AAA. Like, pretty fantastic even.

sophist/clout: very good point on the splitter being known to be a dangerous pitch especially for young developing arms. Splitters are almost nonexistant amongst the newer generation.

With Mathieson pretty much stuck in AAAA (destroying AAA but no success at MLB) and in his upper 20s already, I think the Phils are smart to bring in sutter for his splitter knowledge.

Jose Contreras splitter is more of an offspeed pitch nowadays, and probably wouldnt relate to what Mathieson would like to throw - which would be to emulate his fastball with more of a forkball drop instead of Contreras' arcing, breaking action

BTW, I just want to throw out a "thanks" to Weitzel for the obvious 'throw away' thread.

Clearly, this late in the day, there's no need for a new thread prior to the game thread, especially one devoted to mid-relief September call-ups. This little doozy right here was simply to put that last thread to bed. Cheers, JW!

Andy: Hewitt, like Golson, Mattair, C.J. Henry and D'Arby Myers, is qualified to drive the team bus.

If you're a toolshed fan, though, Jiwan James and Kelly Dugan are the current bright spots. Jiwan is particularly intriguing.

" put that last thread to bed..."

Nay, Preacher. 'Twas to toss it wholeheartedly to the beasts in the ring, as fodder for their unquenchable appetite, it was. May it's soul rest in peace; it lived far beyond it's time and was ready for consignment to a more eternal fate.

re: splitters among young pitchers

Apparently Tim Lincecum's "changeup" is a splitter down to every detail, but insist on calling it his changeup.

clout - Every time I make that list I keep looking forward to the day I can add those two names.

Oh, and Altherr, too.

curt: Well played . . . but not entirely apropos. Just because both plays were inexcusable does not mean they arose out of the same m.o. The August 5 play was a garden variety pickoff by the pitcher, in which Werth had simply taken too big a lead off the base. He had that big lead for a reason: the Phillies were in a tied game in the 9th inning. But it was a dumb play because he wasn't in a base-stealing situation and the extra foot or two of lead did not justify the risk of getting picked off. However, I wouldn't equate that to getting picked off 2nd by the catcher because you aren't paying attention to the game.

Mop-Up Matheison: Pretty Easy.

b-a-p: Both do show a certain level of intellectual ineptitude however. I am, however, against benching the idiot - he is what he is.

Mop-Up is nice, but I still like Mariano. That way he can at least dream about the coffee.

Willard: I grew up in Northern California. I am a Phillies fan because my dad, who is from Philadelphia, is a Phillies fan. It's in my genes. When it comes to basketball & football, I root for the local teams.

BAP: And if you're a Warriors fan, that's a Philly connection too.

Andy: Well, perhaps I parse too finely. But I see no point in benching him.

bap - I am agreeing with you on the benching thing. Dumb and, in this case, ineffective.

Frankly, I think taking away the imported beer will work wonders.

clout - I lived in the Bay Area for five years. No one is a Warriors fan.

mm, if we're utilizing BL to create the nicknames, "Mop Up" would not suffice for Mathieson. BL has annointed Scotty the greatest closer never to close a big league game (because the powers that be are too dumb to realize his obvious greatness, even though his fastball is flat and he's been somewhat lit up in his very brief auditions in the show).

BAP, Gotcha, that explains the indifference and lack of hatred for Wheeler, too, then. Until recently his anti-homer tendencies and general douchebaginess have been confined to the Delaware Valley.

So happy to see that he's able to wreak his stenchitude to a larger viewing audience, thanks to technology (, Extra Innings, etc.).

It only makes sense that I can appreciate Wheels praising the speedy, toolsy kids on the opposing teams on a day-to-day basis while I have to make travel plans just to suck down a Lager from America's Oldest Brewery. Ugh....

bap - yeah, no 2 situations are ever exactly identical, but the relevant point is that there is no excuse. More and more the guy's head is obviously somewhere else. Earlier this month the guy ran into an easy out at 3B a grounder to SS - a blunder no little leaguer would make.

Did you just hear that on DNL? Brett Myers stuck his tongue out at Jayson Werth to cause him to lose focus and get picked off.

A couple of points...

1. Mathieson has already been throwing the split-finger fastball this year. They are bringing in Sutter to help refine it.

Very smart move by the Phils, BTW. Sutter is regarded as being the best to ever throw the splitter. Can't hurt, that's fo sho.

2. Rizzotti has been battling a bad wrist, which he hurt very soon after getting to LV. His playing time has gone away, as this problem has arose.

3. Duckworth is hurt and on the DL at LV.

If there is a "wild card" guy that the Phils could bring up (and add to the 40 man roster), it might be Reading 2B Harold Garcia. I don't expect it, but the Phils are very thin in the infield at the major league level. Wouldn't hurt to have another guy in the mix, as a "just in case" down the stretch. Plus, he's a guy with good speed. Never can have too many fast guys either.


A pitcher brought in to the game must finish the plate appearance barring some kind of injury... just as a player who comes to the plate must finish the plate appearance barring some kind of injury.

You can't bring in a lefty, see the team switch out a righty, throw one pitch and remove him from the game.

But let's not allow baseball rules to get in the way of a good "Charlie is an idiot" rant.

Mark Kram on DNL is one of the biggest bubbleheads I've ever heard talk. He must either post here under many assumed names or he went on a tear over his time in Philly fathering tons of children.

He just complained about sending Blanton on contact. He followed that by saying the ball was hit to first base there was no way he was scoring. My thinking is that Kram has no idea what "run on contact" means.

He's so bad, I shall spell his name backwards...marK kraM

Joe C. mentioned in the last thread about shaving off half of Werth's beard. I think Cholly ought to tell Werth that he's channeling the spirit of George Steinbrenner and George told him that good grooming is part of winning and that hillbilly beard has to go along with his out of balance hair. Cholly will order Werth to shave and get his hair cut. Too much hair weight pulling on his head pulled him off 2nd base last night.

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