Game chat: Phillies remnants play second in Cincy

Pitchers Joe Blanton (3-5, 6.53) and Mike Leake (5-1, 2.92) are scheduled as the barely recognizable Philadelphia Phillies and Cincinnati Reds continue their set starting at 7:05.

Thirteen Phillies on the current 25-man roster weren't on last year's World Series roster. At least 10 of them would be considered replacement level or below. Readers offer a point-counterpoint hours after the Phillies brought out their dead:

"I agree with the poster who said this might be a blessing in disguise, in that Utley will get the rest he needs in order to be a more effective player down the stretch. Polanco is no spring chicken, either, so maybe the same can be said of him. I believe this team can withstand offensive injuries. We've seen it before that the team actually gels with a little more purpose and intensity when others know they have to pick up some slack. You still have Rollins, Howard, and Werth in the lineup and Ibanez is rather due for a hot stretch. And Dobbs is capable of providing some offense with regular playing time (though I tend to run short of optimism when I consider his glove). It's the pitching staff that's more crucial to keep healthy. So long as there are no problems there, there's no need at all to panic." - RSB

"We're boned." - Bender Rodriguez

Lineups: Victorino CF, Dobbs 3B, Rollins SS, Howard 1B, Werth RF, Ibanez LF, Schneider C, Valdez 2B, Blanton P.

Comments

[AFish]

When you get the results of an MRI, you get the results. The claim that the results of Utley's MRI were not clear and he is getting another opinion = the results were horrible and he's trying to find a doctor who will tell him something else. Utley's probably going to be gone for a while.

[st]

agreed. even proefrock said he is getting another opinion to see if it's surgical or non-surgical. so that to me means it's at least a grade 2 which is 4 to 6 weeks or grade 3 which is a tear and he'll need surgery

[thephaithful]

utley mvp 2011! since ya know...he wont get hurt AGAIN right?

[holy mACKEREL]

Do we have a 2nd basemen in double or triple A equivalent to Donald?

[Scott]

At least I had a quality cheesesteak for lunch at John's Roast Pork before I got a phone call with the news about Utley...

[clout]

RK: I'm still laughing at the notion that Tag Bozied should be in the major leagues so I don't have time to laugh at the notion of Utley at 3B.

[Jbird]

holy mAC: not really, and this is what happens when you only draft toolsy outfielders and pitchers.

[st]

matt gelb says the phillies don't think he tore anything

[MG]

Bubonic plague in Cincinnati? Wonder if I should head to Pittsburgh this weekend.

[MG]

15 days?! Hey man, I don't want to rain on your parade, but we're not gonna last 15 hours ...

[clout]

holy: There are no 2Bmen even as good as Bruntlett in Trip A (non-prospects Dorta & Maza) or Double A (non-prospect Ozzie Chavez).

[holy mACKEREL]

In April or May of this year Mike Costanzo, who was in the farm system and I believe was part of the Lidge trade signed w/ the R/Sharks.

Shame the Phils did not have some foresight to sign him to a minor league contract, because wasn't w/ the R/S very long before he signed w/ the Red's AA affiliate. He would have come cheap & w/o trading away talent. This seems to be a attribute the Phils are looking for.

I am not saying he would be the next Mike Schmidt, but he probably would be better than the current minor league replacement we have at 3rd base for Poly.

[The Theory]

I thoroughly laughed at the Bender quote.

Anyway, to quote Beerleaguer nearly every other game, "This feels like a loss."

[GBrettfan]

Well, if anyone was standing on a bridge ready to jump off, I hope you aren't listening to Ricky Bo on 1210AM. He's definitely not as optimistic as Mitch Williams, although I'm not sure how optimistic even Mitch would sound today. But then, I've just listened to Ricky Bo, who sounded like Eeyore, so I'm feeling pretty bummed out right now.

Not that I was lighthearted before with this Utley/Polanco news, but Ricky turned the gloom up.

[clout]

holy: Costanzo is an attribute the Phils are looking for?

I'm beginning to sense that you are utterly clueless about the relative merits of minor league talent.

[clout]

Dobbs batting second strikes me as bizarre. Here's my lineup:

Vic
Rollins
Valdez
Howard
Werth
Ibanez
Schneider
Blanton
Dobbs

[NEPP]

I can't wait for bap to get back...he's gonna flip.

[Brian]

Through two innings in Allentown, Happ has given up three hits, two walks and a run while striking out none.

J.C. Romero started the game and pitched a scoreless inning with two strikeouts.

[NEPP]

After looking at all the options, I will stick with my opinion that Jhonny Peralta is the best fit.

Utley's injury (the whole 2nd opinion thing) sounds really bad. It sounds like he got bad news and he's looking around for a non-surgical answer.

[GTown_Dave]

Batting Dobbs second is an acknowledgement that he will undoubtedly make an Out, but might possibly move Vic over in the process. It's not a great option to move him down to the bottom of an order already featuring Ibañez, Schneider, Valdez & Blanton, either. I don't mind moving Jimmy down, though. So long as he's unable to run the Phils might as well have Vic leading off.

Andy Tracy just hit a 2-run shot in Lehigh. I guess he wants next once Dobbs &/or Castro spontaneously combust.

[Old Phan]

Can Dobbs still bunt? That might help.

[st]

it's not possible for jc romero to pitch in AAA. he's on the phillies

[Bedrosian's Beard]

Costanzo and Bozied are the answers!! Come on, Rube!

[Old Phan]

Gbrettfan, Ricky Bo isn't the most upbeat guy in the world on a good day.

[GTown_Dave]

st: It's possible. This is the continuation of a game started early in the season but not completed due to rain. It was picked up again today.

[NEPP]

GTown beat me to it...continuation makes anything possible.

[GTown_Dave]

In which case I suggest the Phillies halt the '10 season due to injury & continue later in the year.

[GTown_Dave]

Happ: 3IP 5H 2ER 3BB 3K 1HR 77 Pitches (46S/31B)

PhutuePhilz Tweets Happ's velocity as 86-87MPH, w/ a high of 91MPH.

[GTown_Dave]

Edit: PhuturePhilz. My typing is way off today. I hope I'm not injured.

[Old Phan]

GTown, we may have to put you on the 15 Day BL

[NEPP]

Can Happ play 2B?

[NEPP]

I think I just tore a ligament in my thumb typing this post...

Crap!

[MG]

Where's there smoke, there's fire:

- Happ is still clearly hut and trying to pitch through it. He hasn't had a single solid rehab start yet with depressed velocity & sporadic control at best on his fastball.

My bet is that the Phils continue to dick around with him over the next 2-3 weeks, shut him down sometime for good in late July/early August, and will have wound up losing 2 months in his recovery time.

[MG]

Losing 2 months in his recovery time from elbow surgery.

[NEPP]

And once he has TJ surgery in late August, that'll kill him for 2011 too...

Whereas, had he had it in March, he'd be ready for next Opening Day-June timeframe.

[GBrettfan]

I'm not sure BAP will come back once he hears the news, if he hasn't heard already. He may decide to spend the rest of the season out of country! :)

Old Phan, about Ricky Bo, yes, I know. But he was even self-described gloomy this evening!

He made one comment that struck me, and that was that Charlie might be better off not tinkering with the lineup so much - might need to stabilize it (admittedly tough to do when you've got guys in and out of the lineup to begin with) to give guys a sense of security. What do others think?

[Mick in Houston]

I dont know how you cannot 'tinker' with the lineup.

With our 2 and 3 hitters are out, there has to be at least a little 'shake up'.

[Jbird]

Come on Joe!

[Old Phan]

Let's go, Kentucky/Tennesee/Country/Donut Eater/Innings Eater Joe.

[GBrettfan]

Well, what a fun start to the ballgame...for a Reds fan.

Hmm, maybe they'll be my backup team this year.

[NEPP]

Way to come up big with the team hurting, Joe.

[MG]

Shaky defense in RF from Werth continues. Been the single, biggest unexpected letdown this season.

[GTown_Dave]

Old Phan: I see what you did there.

Also,

Matt Gelb "In the past, thumb surgeries for torn ligaments have require 6-10 weeks recovery for players. The Phillies don't think Utley tore anything." (29 June '10)

Of course, there's also this:

Todd Zolecki "The Phillies think Happ's return to the rotation could be closer to weeks than a month ... They do not think Happ needs further medical testing. He had a MRI last Friday." (22 April '10)

And this:

David Murphy "(The Phillies) believe it to be a mild to moderate strain and (are) hopeful it will be a 2-to-4 week recovery." (14 April '10)

Sufficed to say, I'm not putting much faith in what the Phillies "think", "believe" or "hope".

[MG]

Ugh. Nice job Blanton.

[Mick in Houston]

Lets look on the bright side. At least Polly and Chase waited till Jimmy was back till they got injured.

[limoguy]

They'll be happy with a split in Pittsburgh now whereas the Pirates are a team from who they should normally take three out of four.

[GBrettfan]

Not making the Phillies fans happy right now, Joe B....

[NEPP]

If its a mild/moderate sprain, WHY is Utley getting a 2nd opinion from a hand specialist? You dont usually get a 2nd opinion when you hear good news like that...especially if you're Chase Utley.

[Jbird]

inauspicious 1st inning so far

[Old Phan]

GTown, I could never fool you!

Not too sharp there, Donut. At least there wasn't too much damage.

[DH Phils]

The Pirates are an absolutely awful team. Amazingly, their Pythagorean says that at 26-50 they're overperforming by 6 games. Phillies have to take 3 out of 4 there, at least, even without Utley/Polanco.

[BloodStripes]

Why not get a second opinion. Most doctors don't know what their on about

[Kool Earl]

Hib to the jib.

[NEPP]

Ibanez hot streak starts in 3,2,1...

[Old Phan]

nice baserunning there, boys.

[NEPP]

You dont stop Brian Schneider...you only hope to contain him!

[dlhunter]

The babe!

[BloodStripes]

Schneider Man! Schneider Man! Schneider Man!

[Old Phan]

Never a doubt, Schneider!

[NEPP]

Tomorrow's lineup:

Rollins
Werth
Schneider
Howard
etc
etc

[Jbird]

Brian Schneider is my hero

[Hope SE]

As LA said: Other guys are going to have to step up. It has happened over the past several years, can happen again.

[holy mACKEREL]

holy: Costanzo is an attribute the Phils are looking for? posted by: clout | Tuesday, June 29, 2010 at 06:30 PM

clout -

Can you comprehend this...

Constanzo would have come cheaply & w/o trading away talent- which are attributes the Phillies are looking for.

Read & comprehend the whole thought before you launch insults.

[Spitz]

If Schneider continues this Chase Utley impression, we may be ok.

[GTown_Dave]

Happ out after allowing the first 2 on in his 5th inning of work. 4IP 100 Pitches (58S/42B).

[Lincoln Hawkes]

Schneidypoo with the bomb! The replacement-levels are stepping up...

[GTown_Dave]

So does this mean Brian is off the Schneid(er)?

[dlhunter]

Simple pleasures of baseball w/ scrubs in the lineup: watching how quickly a scrub bolts out of the box after hitting a home run, in a single stroke doubling his RBI total for the season.

[MG]

Come back and Schneider his a timely 3-run bomb.

[The Truth Injection]

NEPP: It's pretty standard to get a second opinion on issues. The team wants to get him back as soon as possible. It's possible too that the MRI didn't give a clear image or one doctor may think one treatment is better than another one. It's not a huge issue.

On Happ: In Reading last Wednesday his velocity was sitting at 83-85 so if he is up to 86-87 he is making some progress. If he needed TJ surgery there is a pretty good chance they would've shut him down by now. They have doctors check him out after every start and I'm sure he is doing tests on the elbow and they are monitoring everything. It would be very unusual if a doctor didn't recommend shutting him down now rather than letting him pitch through it.

Brian Schneider stepping up

[MG]

Dave- Wonk, wonk , wonk . . .

[The Truth Injection]

holy: Can you comprehend this?

Mike Costanzo stinks.

[Mick in Houston]

Is there something the reds noticed about Joe Blanton; they all seem to be going to the opposite field

[GTown_Dave]

Happ's final line this evening: 4IP 6H 2ER 4BB 4SO 1HR 100 Pitches (58S/42B). He left the game w/ 2 on & 0 Out in his 5th inning of work. Neither scored.

[Old Phan]

Once again, Kentucky/Tennesee/Country/Donut Eater/Innings Eater Joe not looking sharp.

[DH Phils]

Other attributes that the Phillies are looking for are "ability to hit major league pitching" and "ability to field at a major league level". Since Mike Costanzo can't do either of these, I don't think his price or availability are issues.

[NEPP]

To DH Phils: Thanks...that made me chuckle at least. Good one.

[holy mACKEREL]

tti

you should wait until your civility medications take effect before you post..

later-

[Old Phan]

Muts up 3-0 in the 3rd.

[The Truth Injection]

holy: That still doesn't change the fact that Costanzo stinks. He can't hit, he strikes out a ton, and he is a worse fielder than Dobbs.

But to you that means we should've had some foresight and locked him up

[NEPP]

What was up between Phillips and Jroll there? Seemed like Phillips was yacking at him there.

[Old Phan]

Looks like they were having a good laugh about something.

[GBrettfan]

I know Howard can't get a hit every at-bat, but that grounder looked weaker than his strikeouts.

[sifl]

Dear "The Truth Injection":

No matter how many times you try to flatter clout, he's never going to sit with you at the lunch table.

[Meyer]

Bring Ruiz back as a third baseman again.

[GTown_Dave]

Brown threw out one of the runners Happ left on from RF as he attempted to tag up & move from 2B to 3B, by the way. Are we sure he can't play 2B? Or 3B? Or Pitcher?

[Chris in VT]

Costanzo is nowhere near ML capable. The Phils are going to have to acquire a valid utility-type IF, and Pheralta's as good a suggestion as anyone else out there.

Still wish they'd spent the extra mil in the offseason and signed Felipe Lopez instead of Castro. He'd actually be a legit fill-in for either Polanco or Utley.

[NEPP]

Wow...Miguel Cairo's alive and on an MLB team.

[Andy]

The most important question in determining the outcome of the game tonight:

Who's taller, Dobbs or Cairo?

[NEPP]

Big Joe coming up big just when we needed him too.

[NEPP]

Based on their respective batting averages, it looks like Cairo is the taller 3B.

[The Truth Injection]

sifl: Yeah, cause that's why I think Costanzo stinks.

[Ryan]

Hanley Grand Slam! 4-3 Fish

[AFish]

Last time I checked, lefties can't play 2B or 3B.

[Old Phan]

Fla 4-3 3rd
Atl 1-0 4th

[NEPP]

***Last time I checked, lefties can't play 2B or 3B.***

Who are we talking about here?

~lost~

[NEPP]

Brian Schneider for NL MVP!

[NEPP]

Schneider and Valdez=2010 Murderer's Row!

[Jbird]

Valdez is a beast!

[Scott]

Hey, why not?!?