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Tuesday, November 03, 2009


These teams are a good pairing. Grade A drama every night. I don't buy this "pressure is on the Yankees" sh!t. I'd love the Phillies to be heading home up a game with two to go and, I'm sure they'd love it too.

On to Game 6! We need vintage Pedro and Howard to break out of his mini-slump. I still believe.

when the good guys come back and win this series will girardi's decision to go with a three man rotation go down as an all-time awful decision?

I've never seen a team argue so many pitches like the Yankees have this series. Is this normal for them?

Cole's comment before his "anxious for the season to be over" comment was that he looked forward to an opportunity to redeem himself in a game 7.

I don't know if there is more pressure on the Yankees, but I'm sure they don't want this series to go to 7 games.

quit the fuc?ing context flipper.
John Kruk with a true statement - Ryan Howard needs to show up in game 6 (or 7). How about depositing one of those sliders/ cutters from Pettite in the left field bleachers, buddy? He does need to pop one.

phlipper: Pretend Cole had said nothing at all. Based on performance alone, would you really want him pitching a deciding Game 7?

Besides which, the Phillies MUST win Game 6 for there to even be a Game 7 ... so why worry about Cole Hamels right now?

No one said this one will be easy. But I like our chances wednesday with Petitte pitching on short rest, old as he is.

What did you guys think of cole's comments (I noticed the allusion)? Are they out of context? Can't believe that guy's fallen so far, so fast.

We can moan all we want about Charlie's decisions this Series, but surely the worst decision was using Burnett on three days rest once the Yanks had won their third game.

Even with the win, a very poor showing by Uncle Cholly tonight:

1. Pulling Vic instead of Ibanez for Francisco when up by 6 runs and need defense.
2. Pinch-hitting Stairs instead of Bruntlett to bunt with Chooch on first.
3. Leaving Lee in too long unnecessarily
4. Having Madson pitch to the Yankees lefties instead of Eyre

And didn't he forget to double-switch during Game 4 too?

Hamels has reacted poorly over the last two months any time an umpire's call doesn't go his way. It's an unmistakeable pattern. I laugh at the stat freaks and their BABIP is all luck stuff. He may be unlucky but, he throws a lot of hittable balls over the white of the plate and a considerable number lately have been after an adverse call on a close pitch.

"Pretend Cole had said nothing at all. Based on performance alone, would you really want him pitching a deciding Game 7?"

G-Town: I'd go with him until he runs into trouble. That could mean bringing in Happ in the first inning. But the reason for posting Cole's earlier comment wasn't advocating one way or another that he starts in game 7. I agree - let's see what happens in game 6 before we worry about game 7.

Sorry that reporting what Cole says bothers you, Hugh.

how did you interpret that as bothering me, phucker? Turn on your sarcasm detector.

@timr - agreed, especially since Burnett can be wild even when he's on full rest

phlipper: Fair enough. I actually don't think that's a bad idea, either. Still, I'm the superstitious type. Don't wanna go putting my cart ahead of my horse. ;-)

"We can moan all we want about Charlie's decisions this Series, but surely the worst decision was using Burnett on three days rest once the Yanks had won their third game."

Burnett had an outstanding record on 3 days rest prior to tonight. Burnett was awful, but Lee went on full rest and he wasn't sharp either.

A move like pulling Shane is a legit criticism to make - but then again, we don't know what Charlie was told about Shane's condition, and he pulled him with what, a 4 run lead in the 8th inning? I also agree that it would have made sense to leave Park in to bat, given that Madson has seen a lot of work lately.

Somehow, none of UC's "poor" moves did not affect the outcome of the game,and pitching wise, I'll take UC's decisions over Joe's.
Not to get too far ahead, but I do have concerns about who will pitch Game 7.

Yeah, right, you're clearly not bothered, Hugh. That's why you've stooped to calling me "phucker" after I posted about the rest of Hamels' comments.

That's believable.

There was absolutely nothing wrong with pulling Vic out of the game at that point.
I keep hearing about how good Burnett is on 3 days rest. Sorry, but that is a case of what happens during the regular season does not apply here. This is November, not July (or for that matter, September)

I'm really get sick of Posada. He spends more time in the home plate ump's face than he does in the batter's box.

phlipper, phucker, what's the difference? Sober up or knuckle up, dude. I was kidding - what part of "context" confused you?

I wonder if Vic is going to be in teh lineup on Wednesday. He did seem to stop with the hand waving and painful gesticulations before Manuel took him out but, it was clearly bothering him. Those small bones can be cracked (hands, feet, ribs) and it doesn't show up on the first x-ray. Hope he's good to go with a day's rest.

I'm sick of fracking Johnny Damon, too (who my husband used to call "Unfrozen Caveman Baseball Player" when he played for the Red Sox) who, once they came to CBP, became Matt Diaz.

Geebus, I hope he turns back into a pumpkin when they get back to Yankee.

I don't care if Hamels said that he wants the ball. That's like saying that Iverson wants to take every shot, so let's let him. (Incidentally, he made his debut for Memphis tonight. They're losing to the worst team in the league in overtime.) You have to look at actual performance, and Hamels looks like a mental mess right now. The guy's gone 5 or less in every postseason game he's pitched this year, and just 4 innings in the last two. It doesn't get any worse than that. People act as if he were an established All-Star, a Smoltz or something of that ilk who's just going through a rough patch and is so good that you have to keep starting him through the bad times. He's nothing of the sort. His track record, really, is hardly any longer than Chad Billingsley's or Scott Kazmir's, and their managers didn't hesitate to throw them in the pen this year over a bad season, or in CB's case, a bad month or two.

Tartan: I would defend most, if not all, of those moves:

(1) Vic was obviously pulled from the game because his injury was clearly affecting his play, both on offense & even defense.

(2) Stairs is horrible, but Bruntlett can't bunt at all, so you might as well take your shot with Stairs, who at least has a chance to hit one out.

(3) If Cholly left Lee in too long, it was only by 1 batter. But, as our best & hottest starter, Lee deserves every benefit of the doubt. And have you seen our bulllpen?

(4) Eyre hasn't been terribly effective in the playoffs & Madson, despite some rough patches, has generally been getting the job done (and did tonight, as well).

If it were my call, I would have simply let Park hit for himself & left him in the game to start the 9th. I come from the school of thought that you don't arbitrarily pull an effective pitcher from the game. But that just doesn't seem to be the way it's done nowadays.

If victorino is as bad as some of hte rumours (cant grip a ball etc) would you start fransico in centerfield then shane in a less important left field in game 6? Idk, he can still track down a ton of balls, so maybee that is a stupid suggestion, but fransico is no slouch with range either...

Vic's hand is certainly going to be swollen and sore tomorrow, but maybe it will end up only being sore, not broken, and with the travel day to heal, he'll be good to go for Game Six. They certainly need him; even just his first inning HBP was kind of a catalyst for the game. Francisco is okay, but he is not the sparkplug that Vic is.

Imagine how much criticism Charlie would have gotten if he had left Vic in and the winning run scored on a throwing error by Vic because he couldn't grip the ball.

** warning long post ahead**

What an emotional game. Can't believe this ride is continuing. I was telling people (and posted last night) that I never wanted to go to a game less than tonight. The top of the first didn't help. But Mr. Octember brought me back.

I said Phillies in 7 before the series. Hoping we can get push that game that far. If we do... it's a anybody's ball series. Get us another whack at CC. Come on please...

Just got back from the game, so I haven't had time to read the thread. So sorry for repeating any thoughts... Here are 9 things from tonight game...

1. Not sure how the Phillies seat people for games, but an oddity in seating had me sitting in the same row with 5 guys I graduated high school some of who I haven't seen in 18 years. (Except for when they sat in front of me in Game 4 of the NLCS). Also sat directly next to a guy who sat next to me game 1 of the NLDS.
2. Cliff Lee really battled today. It might not match his incredible game 4 performance, in some ways it might have been MORE important. (We'll get to the 8th inning a second).
3. I'm not one for supersitions, but I went to see Pearl Jam for Game 1 of the World Series. Under threats and protests from my friends. after we won, some of my friends suggested I just sit outside the spectrum with my iPod for the rest of the series. Trying to figure out what superstition worked best for the win? Went to 6 games these playoffs. 4-2 record. Tony Luke's Roast Pork 0-2. Grilled Chicken from the new grill in the alley. 1-0. Bulls BBQ 2-0. Planet Hoagie Chicken Cutlet Italiano 1-0. The real key? My Dad 3-0 in the playoffs. I didn't take my Dad to any games (I only bought single tickets to each game, I'm a bad son. Taking my Dad to his first World Series game. Well... win-loss hard to top.)
4. Jimmy Rollins had some really great at bats tonight. Mr. Rollins has a .417 OBP in these playoffs.
5. The Victorino pitch was absolutely a purpose pitch. Burnett and Girardi should be fined. Like a pu$$y, girardi ran out of the dugout to lobby for his pitcher. I don't care if you want to get redemption, but you can injure a guy like that. In the post game presser, Chase Utley ribbed AROD by mention when asked about his game plan: "Just hoping not to get hit... (mentions Arod and inside pitching) hey sometimes you get hit". If vic loses time or is hampered in anyway, I hope the Yanks are sufficiently punished. I'm fine with no ejection, you have to let the players settle it on the field. But there needs to be retribution. Afterwards, AROD went over and talked to Burnett obviously for "having his back." I wanted blood.
6. No need. Chase Utley took care of business and put one in the seats. How 'bout the young man. All during the second half of the season, one of my buddies had been bashing me because I called Utley the MVP of the team and he would send me Howard updates. (I LOVE HOWARD so its hard to argue either way). Utley has shown up this post season. We need the big guy to step up. 5 HR in one series with 2 more games to go. Reggie Jackson. Chase Utley. Love it.
7. I liked that the Phillies were relatively aggressive on the basepaths. They MUST keep that up, even against Pettite.
8. Charlie. Charlie. Charlie. I know Lee's our horse. But you had to have a short leash on him. Once Damon was on, that's when you had to get Park in the game. You had to. It almost cost us the series. Lee was done. 6 run lead. And you need 6 outs. That's time for your bullpen. If the Phillies are going to win this series, you need your bullpen to get at least you 6 outs in each of the next two games. Note: Myers warmed in the 8th. Lidge and Eyre in the 9th.
9. First and Third. Derek Jeter at the plate. Double Play was the best scenario you could hope for. I thought there was NO WAY. NO WAY Jeter was going to do anything BUT get a big hit there. And getting Texiera to roll over. Just WOW. I'm glad Arod stood at the circle to watch that.

Looking forward to the day off tomorrow to read the usual beerleaguer sniping over minutiae once the victory wears off.

According to Rube, Jr., Vic's x-rays came back negative; he has a contusion, not a fracture.

The Phillies are 3-0 in their last 3 game 5s in the World Series. Were 0-2 in the first 2. (none in 1950).

And of course they are 1-1 in Game 6's.

Yahoo! Sports is reporting that Hamels & Myers nearly came to blows in the clubhouse after tonight's game:

"As Myers walked past Hamels near Hamels’ locker he said, mocking, 'What are you doing here? I thought you quit.'

Hamels, the witness said, responded with an expletive.

Before the situation escalated, Myers was guided away by a team official."

mike c: Yeah, getting Teixeira was enormous. A-Rod has gotten one huge hit after another in this post-season. If Teixeira had somehow reached base & A-Rod had come up representing the go-ahead run, something tells me tonight's game would not have had a happy ending.

BAP, if that's true, it makes Myers even more useless than before, if that's possible.

b_a_p: I'm surprised Cole didn't burst into tears.

Todd Zolecki's twitter - Ruben Amaro Jr. said he has been told Victorino has no fracture. He said it's a contusion.

Just got back in from visiting my old friend on Death Row. Seems like he got a reprieve...

Hamels can go F**k himself after he made those comments about wanting this season to be over. I don't want him anywhere near game 7. Lets go get Webb or Lackey. Trade Hamels for Halladay. Get this softie off our team.

Get rid of Myers long before you let Hamels go.

I can understand why myers would be upset. Say what you want about him, but he fought hard to come back and try to help this team, even though he knows he probably wont be here next year. To hear that a player is already looking forward to next year in the middle of the WS, i can see why myers was upset

If this is true, is there a good reason to start a fight with a teammate in the WS, especially after a win? No reason at all. Maybe he did fall out of an SUV after all...on his head.

Few minor points:

- Cholly did save he took out Vic because he was concerned about Vic being able to hold the baseball properly in the field.

- Even if Vic only has a contusion, he isn't going to be magically ready to go on Wed. night. If anything, he likely will have significant inflammation and some pain tomorrow morning because he didn't follow the proper treatment (ice immmediately and rest of the muscles around the general area as much as possible). Biggest issue by far for the Phils in Game 6 will be Vic's health status and the decision to start him or not.

I was at the game tonight...the fans were loud and into it the whole game. I was in left field and can't understand how Yankee fans had several complete blocks of seats. They came down from New York on busses and sat together. How does that happen?....can anyone explain how they got all those tickets together?? By the way, everytime Yankee fans started a cheer, we countered with one or added on to theirs....e.g. when Yankee fans chanted Derek Jeeter, we added "sucks" everytime they said his name.

Should have left Vic in the game. You replace Ibanez with Fransisco and Arod never gets his double.

Kind of rich for the biggest headcase and whiner on the team to be complaining to Hamels about his comments. Not to mention that it doesn't do the team any good to get our sensitive and probable Game 7 starter all upset.

Wow, Myers is a jerk. I mean, if that comment comes from anyone else on the team, you can chalk it up to some tough love in anticipation of a possible game seven (sort of akin to that great moment between Rollins and Burrell in the clubhouse last year).

But that would be a bad idea anyway; this isn't some slump Cole's muddling through, its a complete meltdown probably due to the Verducci effect. Plus, because its Myers, you know it wasn't tough love or motivation, just straight-up bullying, kicking a guy when he's down. Think Cole said anything like that after Myers beat his wife in the middle of Boston? Or after Myers got sent to the minors? What an *sshole.

Tray, very true.
Considering the outcome, I don't understand why anyone has an issue with Cholly pulling an injured player out of a game.

Myers probably believes he should be starting. What a nut.

Maybee i am in the minority, but i cant say i am all that mad at Myers for saying what he said, its not like cole can pitch much worse than he has so far, so maybe it will fire him up. Either way, hearing a player on your team say he cant wait for the year to be over cannot be a good thing to hear, are there better ways to get that across to a teammate? sure, but i cant realy get that upset at myers here, he makes a damn good point.

Although i have been an Myers aplogist since day one, even did a "myers flyers" thing a few games for him (although he lost both games we went as the Myers flyers, so the fan club died) so i might just be biased here

I really wonder sometimes, if people on this blog have ever played sports... been in a locker room... or hung around a group of guys... This is the kind of stuff that happens. This isn't soccer. Sometimes this is the way to handle things "in house".

The only real issue is that Myers said that in front of non players.

I'm defending Myers the person, for any other transgression. But if this fires up Hamels... and he wants the ball in Game 7 to man up... Then we may have Myers to thank.

Mike, you may be right, but Myers should be the last person to say something like that. If J-Roll or Saint U want to talk to him, fine, but Myers has no need to be obnoxious, whatever the circumstances are.

I hope this lights a fire under Hamels ass. Myers may be a c*cksucker, but at least somebody wants to win.

"if this fires up Hamels... and he wants the ball in Game 7 to man up... Then we may have Myers to thank."

If Hamels actually has a good game for what will feel like the first time in a century, how would we ever know that Myers was the cause? Besides, Hamels doesn't strike me as the sort of pitcher who pitches well angry, but that's just cheap armchair psychology.

Alas, just because it's not broken doesn't mean it's not serious. I would be surprised to see Vic in the line-up for game 6. Maybe an appearance as a pinch runner but if the guy can't throw or grip a bat properly, it's foolish to play him.
If this turns out to be the case, I have a hunch that Francisco has a big game.
Just a hunch ...

"If Hamels actually has a good game for what will feel like the first time in a century, how would we ever know that Myers was the cause?"

Via the same unimpeachable reasoning by which we've come to attribute his struggles to his complete, total wussification. Only, in this case, the inference isn't quite as threadbare, since we actually have evidence for the thing we're deeming to be the cause.

I haven't liked the way Hamels has been acting since he threw the hissy fit after Utley's bad throw in the Dodger series.

Being said, Myers is the wrong guy to deliver the message, and wasn't trying to help. We shouldn't even know about this, it shouldn't have happened in front of anyone but other players, or behind closed doors.

Game 6 is a much tougher game than Game 7. Assuming the Yanks throw Pettite, our lefties need to get some hits off him. Take that damn cutter to left field if he gets it over the plate.

got a call around 6:30 last night that a friend of a friend was sick and so tickets just fell into my lap. what a night! nothing beats a phillies win. since my first playoff taste in '93, the phils are now 7-1 in games i got to attend, with the sole loss kendrick's to the rockies in '07. pretty cool. i am happy (but tired). and there's still more baseball to be played. so today is a good day.

mike cunningham,

Vic was interviewed after the game pretty late. He said he didn't think there was any intent on Burnett's part, and that Burnett apologized to him over near first base, saying "My bad."

On Hamels,

Cole was quoted as saying he would love to pitch game 7, that was every pitcher's ultimate dream, that he had said some things that did not come out right, and that it was hard sometimes to play the game and talk too.

Anyway, glad our guys remain alive and kicking. Plenty of drama in game six with Pedro going in Yankee Stadium, the team's back against the wall, in what could be his last hurrah. Awesome.

After the game last night, Cole Hamels stood at his locker and smiled sheepishly and said, "I've said some dumb things. I think everybody has . . . It's hard. It's hard to play baseball and talk sometimes."

I can't believe we're still playing. It's not unreasonable to think we have a good chance to win Game 6. I have to say, after Sunday, I did not think we'd be here. But here we are.

I don't know whether Blanton's pitch had bad intent but, I'm reasonably certain Burnett's did not. In the same situation, I want the Phillies pitchers to throw hte same pitch. You throw at the bunter to make it difficult to bunt, hoping for a pop up or a foul.

I hope this makes some people happier.

"Sometimes I might not say the best things or the smartest things, but I've learned and am learning," Hamels said. "I wasn't able to sleep the past couple of nights because of it."


"I went to Charlie just to talk to him because that's who I am, and I think he understands that," Hamels said. "I just wanted to tell him my true thoughts -- that I'll never ever quit. I want to play this game until somebody takes it away from me.

"I think Charlie knows me. He has managed me for quite a few years. I think the only doubt it left in people's minds were the fans, and you know, it hurts. I love the city of Philadelphia, I play as hard as I possibly can. I might not necessarily have the results that they hope [for], but I know that if I go out there, and do everything I possibly can, and in the end they see [that], then I think they can respect that."

Myers is a joke. I'm not gonna get into the substance of what happened--it's a locker room, guys in high pressure situations, those things happen. And I'm not excusing what Hamels has done or said this postseason. He needs to step it up.

But the amount of people here who fetishize the "toughness" that Myers has, while dismissing Hamels as essentially a p*ssy, are idiots. Myers has been an underachiever his whole career, while Hamels has had a better career by age 25 than most pitchers in Phillies history. Where was Myers' "toughness" when he pouted about not being a closer and showed up fat and out of shape last year and had to be sent to the minors? Or when he showed up the his first rehab start this year with a black eye after having been in a bar fight? What a team player.

And that's not even touching on what kind of person Myers has shown himself to be--and the trouble his actions have caused the team over the years. I hope he's reformed, and I'm willing to give people a lot of the benefit of the doubt. But just consider what you would think about someone who did what he did if you knew them in real life.

I am not surprised by Myers' actions. Even though I don't think that was the best thing to do after a good win, I do think he did it to light a fire under Cole's backside in case there is a game 7.

Regarding the game, I am just amazed each time the Yankees are at bat with all the power they have. It is truely unbelievable. I think I watched the top halves of the 8th and 9th innings with my jaw on the ground due to the gauntlet of hitters.

Also, watched some of the post game coverage on the YES Network and some interesting tidbits from that. 1.) They showed the NY Media interviewing Coke and he was extremely mad and said that "the pitches he made to Utley and Ibanez were good pitches". Really? They both were right down the pike son. He then yelled (literally) that he wanted the ball again next game. 2.) They then flashed to the Tex interview and he also had interesting ideas. One reporter asked him "What happened in your last at bat?" to which Tex responded paraphrasing here, "Well you know he threw me a fastball for strike one then I swung at 2 changeups. But you did see I got a big hit in Game 4 right?". I mean wow, no accountability at all.

Can't wait for the day this is what I see in my rearview mirror.

syreM tterB

He's going one way i'm going the other.

What a drama queen.
Stupid Stupid Stupid

"I was at the game tonight...the fans were loud and into it the whole game. I was in left field and can't understand how Yankee fans had several complete blocks of seats. They came down from New York on busses and sat together. How does that happen?....can anyone explain how they got all those tickets together??"

They were buses of Yankees employees and their guests...we had the whole section 407b up in NYC for Games 1 & 2, so it's done fairly often.

No matter how this turns out (and I still think the Phillies will win) I am very proud to be a fan of this team and this organization. The Phillies defended this championship with honor and dignity. They played hard every night and didn't make excuses or take cheap shots at the opposition when they lost. When they made mistakes they owned up to them. Sometimes it's not easy to recognize true greatness when it's in your midst.

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