Game chat: Phillies begin final leg of AL schedule

Left-handers Cole Hamels (4-3, 4.24) and Ricky Romero (4-3, 3.59) toe the slab when the Phillies and Jays open a three-game set in Toronto, Onterio, Canada. First pitch is 7:05.

Preview: With the life drained from nearly the entire team these days, the Phils face an opponent that contributed heavily to the sad state of things just a few days ago. Romero matched up with Hamels in Tuesday’s 10-inning loss and pitched well, giving up three runs in seven innings while striking out nine. Toronto (40-34) came ready to play, and the Phils will struggle again this weekend if they continue to play like they have these last two weeks. Once again, the Phils will not have Jimmy Rollins in the lineup, verified by Scott Lauber. For an inside look at Rollins’ slump, be sure to read the latest from Fangraphs.com. [Link]

Drabek: As the Phillies continue to eye alternates for their starting rotation, coaches gushed over Kyle Drabek’s performance last night in Reading. From Mike Drago’s report in the Reading Eagle: "I think he could've pitched in the big leagues tonight with what he had," said R-Phils pitching coach Steve Schrenk. "His stuff was good. His fastball was explosive. He was pitching inside, throwing his breaking ball for strikes, and he used his changeup later in the game. His fastball and his curveball early were big league pitches." In five starts, the 21-year-old right-hander is 5-0 with a 2.43 ERA. [Link]

Comments

[Iceman]

Hahaha, love the simple picture of the bird, J. The lack of a pain-staking graphic kind of fits the aura surrounding the team and the fan base right now.

[clout]

JW: Love the ornithologically correct Blue Jay.

[clout]

This Ricky Riccardo, isn't he the lefty that held the Phils to 3 runs in 7 IP while striking out 9 because guys were swinging at everything outside the strike zone? And doesn't he have a band?

[James L (Forever a Phillies fan!)]

I know it's probably too soon but considering the abysmal preformance of the Phils pitching staff this year, it just might be time to promote Drabek. He seems to have the mental outlook that would allow him to take his lumps (hopefully not to many) and still be able to contribute.

What do we have to lose?

[TrueGrit]

7-8-9 of Coste, Scruntlett and Ruiz...barf

[J.R. King]

If Kyle Drabek joins the rotation now and starts every 5th game from now until the playoffs start, his arm will fall off. Before this year, he's never pitched more than 54 innings in a professional season. He's currently at 95 innings on the year.

The same goes for Bastardo, who has never pitched over 98 innings. Unless the Phils want to bring up Carlos Carrasco, who has pitched between 140 and 160 innings in the last 3 years, the only choice for No. 5 starter who can last a full season is J.A. Happ.

[bay_area_phan]

J.R.: Happ is currently taking up residence as the No. 2 or 3 starter, so that pretty much rules him out of contention for the No. 5 starter's job.

[clout]

From sneed: "RELAX. It's not time to start finding flaws with our single-A prospects because the Phillies draft too many "toolsy" players and not enough Latin Americans.

Look how many guys they drafted on the team that just won the World Series."

How many of those WFC guys were toolsy prospects as opposed to polished prospects? How many were Latin free agents?

[joe]

same knock on hamels the year he was called up.

i sure like his pedigree, and his numbers look amazing. give the kid a shot. at least before ya trades him.

[Iceman]

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but Ian Snell was sent down to the minors per his request due to 'negativity' in Pittsburgh. You think Rube is going to inquire?

[clout]

James L: "What do we have to lose?"

Well, he'd probably be ineffective because the big leagues are a tough jump for a kid with exactly 5 games of Double A experience and that could undermine his confidence and maybe wreck him as prospect (see Gavin Floyd) plus cost the team a chance for the playoffs because they didn't trade for a major league pitcher, but other than that, not a thing.

[J.R. King]

b_a_p: Put them in whatever order you want. My point is the Phillies rotation needs to be Hamels, Blanton, Moyer, Happ, and either Carrasco or someone picked up in a trade. The only other pitchers who could handle pitching that many innings are Kendrick and Park.

[bay_area_phan]

Ian Snell as a reclamation project who might be able to help us in future years: great idea.

Ian Snell as a fix for our 2009 starting pitching problems: awful idea.

[joe l]

Too soon for Drabek for a host of reasons.

[bay_area_phan]

J.R.: Yeah, agree with you. I always find it sort of ridiculous when people start talking about the 5 different starting pitching spots as if they are completely different positions (i.e., "We need to move Happ to No. 5 because he's not good enough to be a No. 3," or "Moyer's fine as a No. 5; the guy who needs replacing is Blanton who is not a No. 2"). So, when you said that Happ has to be the No. 5, I thought you were guilty of the same faulty logic. But what you're saying is correct: the order doesn't matter. A fifth starter, by definition, is the 5th best guy in your rotation -- regardless of the order in which the manager lined them up at the start of the season. I'm one of Happ's biggest fans, but on a decent staff, a rookie who has trouble throwing strikes would be the fifth best starter. On the Phillies' staff, he is third best. That cannot continue if the Phillies are to have any serious chance of winning the division.

[Hope SE]

See we've got Balkin' Bob at 2nd tonite. Odds on a balk call?

[tw]

Reason #9billion to not call up Drabek: He's also playing his first full season after Tommy John surgery.

...Sounds like just the time to dramatically increase his workload.

[denny b.]

For anyone who had June 26 for the date that Lou Pinelia and Milton Bradley would have their first major blowup, you win a prize.

My brother is at the LV/Indianapolis game tonight and will be giving me messages on Carrasco's start tonight and how he looks. Could be a very important start for CC tonight.

[G-Town Dave]

So what's the point of admitting the umpiring crew f*cked up if no one is suspended, fined or even reprimanded? As LA just said, "It's like flunking a test & passing." Umpiring has gotten exponentially worse since MLB abolished the League offices. Disgraceful.

[Spitz]

Anyone know what Vic is hitting in the leadoff spot this season? I can't remember him doing much at all in the 1 hole - maybe leadoff is just cursed for the Phillies.

[Hope SE]

GTD -- why do you link the dropoff in umpiring with the abolition of league offices?

I recall so well Whitey railing against the guys in blue just about the way LA does, and that would certainly have included time when the leagues controlled.

[bay_area_phan]

Ricky Romero -- he of the 16-22, 4.42 career minor league record -- is the 2009 version of Tim Redding.

[CarlosBeltransexual]

Nothing like TMac fawning over the old Bluejays.

[EastFallowfield]

To be fair, Romero's had quality starts in all but two of his starts this year.

We'd love to have someone with a 3.59 ERA.

[PhilsGal]

Vic in 2009:
leading off - .214/.250/.381 in 42 ABs
hitting 2nd - .325/.386/.478 in 203 ABs

[bay_area_phan]

Was going to mention this yesterday but it slipped my mind. Not to nit-pick, but I would sure be interested in knowing the logic behind having a guy with a .359 OBP hitting 9th, while a guy with a .234 OBP hits 8th.

[denny b.]

Rod the Bod would be a Hall of Famer if he got to play the Phillies all the time.

I am sick and tired of watching that lug kick our tails.

[bensdad00]

F*ck Barajas, limp off you lazy MF'er - now we just need to hit Rolen in the ribs with fastballs two or ten times and I'll be happy

[G-Town Dave]

Hope: Growing up I watched a lot of Orioles baseball as well as Phils baseball, & I always felt umpiring was generally better in the NL than it was the AL. The abolition of the League offices & subsequent merging of the umpires into one, big pool screwed that all up. Also, Whitey (a career NLer) never faced, or even had much occasion to watch, either AL or (as he passed before the abolition of the League offices) combined umpiring crews. If he did, I doubt he'd have been very pleased w/ what he saw.

[Jack]

bap: Actuallly, it makes a lot of sense. It's the reason why having the pitcher bat 8th helps you score more runs. Since your top 3 hitters are usually among your best, and they bat the most, getting guys on base for them is a good idea.

[bay_area_phan]

Jack: Well, I agree that your explanation makes sense. However, your explanation is clearly not Cholly's explanation. If it were, then he would have the pitcher bat 8th too -- which he has never done in his life.

I think Cholly bats Bruntlett ahead of Ruiz because he honestly believes Bruntlett is the better hitter.

[G-Town Dave]

What's that old saying about the leopard & his spots?

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9737884/Bradley-leaves-ballpark-early-after-tirade>Pinella Sends Bradley Home

(Apologies if this has already been noted)

[AFish]

I think Sarge is a poor man's Joe Morgan.

[bensdad00]

Wev'e traded a leadoff man who pops up for one who strikes out - i'm going to cry

[AFish]

People need to recognize that when no one is hitting, rearranging the lineup is like rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic.

[bay_area_phan]

At least if the Phillies get no-hit today, we won't have to debate which of their horrific performances represented "rock bottom."

[Kool Earl]

Its starting to feel like if the Jays get one or 2 more runs they are going to amount to be insurance runs. No way does the Phillies withstand an offensive collapse similar to the 2-month shutdown last summer as they just dont have the pitching to tread water they way they did last year until everything came together. I wish this team could flex some muscle rather than having to grasp at "resilience" or a crap division

[Hope SE]

GTD: Thanks. Never followed/watched enough AL to note a distinction. Thought the AL guys just wore their chest protectors differently.

[Hope SE]

Whoever is watching on TV: Is this guy hitting spots consistently? Or are we just flailing at junk?

[Kool Earl]

Cant the Phillies at least get some cheap bloopers or seeing eye rollers? Its like its been all K's pop-ups and weak grounders right to a defender

[NEPP]

THe offense is suddenly a joke and Hamels has forgotten how to be an efficient pitcher. He suddenly throws a ton of pitches per inning and can't go deep into games anymore. WTF is going on.

[bensdad00]

gamecast frozen AGAIN

[G-Town Dave]

Wow. Two blown calls on one pitch. Awesome.

[Kool Earl]

One base hit and this game looks out of hand.

[bay_area_phan]

Just read on Phuture Phillies that Mike Arbuckle, now with the Royals, is watching Carlos Carrasco pitch at LV tonight. We also know that Gillick has been in town for the last week. These 2 facts, taken together, lend fodder for my belief that a Gil Meche deal could be under discussion. Phuture Phillies, however, speculates that it could be Brian Bannister, who sounds a lot more in keeping with the Phillies' usual pattern.

[Kool Earl]

Game over

[GBrettfan]

Hamels, we need you, don't blow it tonight! Or do you think he already feels he's lost the game by giving up 1 run, with the way our offense has been going and the way the past 2 weeks (or is it only 1? It seems an eternity) have been. Crap. 3-0 now.

[G-Town Dave]

... and Cole promptly unravels. Nice job, "Ace".

[Knight]

Oh well, this game is probably over with the way the Phillies offense has been going.

This team is toast, wake me up in 2010.

[heycholly]

to quote wbmason

(the phillies) 1 source of aggravation

WONDERFUL

[heycholly]

WHOSE PITCHIN' TOMORROW?

[GBrettfan]

Our guys are just so frustrated right now, I speculate, that they are playing tense.

[NEPP]

Technically, it wasn't PP over at phuturephillies.com but gregg (another of the main posters there). Meche would be a much better pick personally. Bannister is still pretty inconsistent and is a junkballer (his FB is worse than Blantons). Meche is the superior pitcher overall.

[GBrettfan]

Happ's supposed to pitch tomorrow for us, heycholly.

[NEPP]

Hamels is suffering from a WS hangover and has been all year. Its clear at this point. We aren't gonna win again this year. We should build for 2010. Too many little injuries and our pitching staff is already toast in late June. Not exactly great indicators. Why trade the farm for a longshot chance at repeating.

[heycholly]

I'm asking because the way this game is goin' - the phillies will consider getting a hit as a victory...

[AFish]

The Phillies are playing like the gNats.

[bay_area_phan]

I'm well aware that picking on the starting pitcher when we're getting no-hit sort of misses the point. But, when it comes to finding fault with the 2009 Phillies, there is more than 1 point to be made.

Fact is, Hamels is pitching yet another abysmal game. His ball-strike ratio is good, but his command in the strike zone is again bad &, for the second time in the last three games, he is struggling to put batters away after getting 2 strikes on them. As a result, his pitch count is way up & we'll be lucky to get even 6 innings out of him. His pattern all year has been to pitch one good game, then follow it up with a stinker. He is supposed to be an ace, but he has been pitching like a middle-of-the-rotation starter this year. And a bad middle-of-the-rotation starter at that.

[denny b.]

Carrasco through 2 innings:

1 hit, 0 BB's 2 K's. LV leads 4-0.

CC is throwing his fastball, curveball and changeup for strikes and mixing his pitches well. Only hit was on a bloop, to shallow left.

[G-Town Dave]

NEPP: I agree w/ you 100%, esp. the last sentence.

[heycholly]

you're right NEPP - when the phils went on that inter--league slump last year, there were not the mental mistakes and general malaise that is occurring this year..

[NEPP]

Hamels is pitching tired...I'm terrified that he's gonna blow out his arm at some point this year from overuse. He threw a TON of pitches last year and doesn't have the greatest track record with injuries. He's still pretty young and has piled a lot of work on his arm.

[G-Town Dave]

Well, you could see that coming a mile away.

[Knight]

God knows the home plate ump deserved it. He's been terrible these last few innings.

[NEPP]

Well, he was already at 105 pitches anyway. No point in leaving him out there much longer as it was. Hopefully Cole isn't suspended on top of the ejection.

[GBrettfan]

Sign of mounting frustration: Cole lets his emotions get to him regarding the inconsistent strikes-balls. Sign of dumb umping: he ejects an already exiting Hamels. Sign of how nothing can go right for the Phils: Feliz times that leap wrong, Hamels stumbles and isn't able to get to 1B in time. Sign of how bad things are: Park is coming in to relieve Hamels in only the 5th inning. Park - will he fare better than Cole with the changing strike zone?

[G-Town Dave]

NEPP: Would it matter if he was? The team doesn't seem to win when he starts regardless of how Cole pitches.

[Knight]

And now Park is hurt. Awesome.

Phillies need the All-Star break right now.

[PhillyBlunt]

career=over

thank god he's never showing up again in a phil's uni.

[GBrettfan]

???!!!

[G-Town Dave]

Season = Over.

And I mean that quite seriously.

[NEPP]

Cole has averaged 105.7 pitches per start over his last 10 starts (counted from his first full start after the injury issues). Lots of pitches but not too many excessive games. High point was 117 on May 19th against Cinci. He threw 110 on 3 other occasions. No brutal arm killing games so far this year from UC.

[GBrettfan]

I think none of the Phillies should go to the ASG. I think, instead, they should all go fishing, something, some kind of relaxing bonding experience.

[denny b.]

The Sergio Escalona express will be needed later tonight to clear customs.

[NEPP]

Good thing we're still on the hook to pay Park another 1.5 million in salary. This was a guy that should have been grateful for a major league invite type contract let alone a guaranteed 2.5 million plus major incentives. He won't be missed.

Good thing we let Koplove walk and kept calling up Escalona instead of him back in May.

Stupid move. Amaro is a fvcking moron so far with the callup/send-downs this year.

[Knight]

This umpire is just horrible. Seriously, there needs to be an intervention of some kind.

[NEPP]

How does Bruntlett still have a roster spot? Surely there is some AAAA player that would kill for his roster spot. Our bench is a joke this year.

[G-Town Dave]

NEPP: You could have left off at "Amaro is a fvcking moron" & still been absolutely correct.

[PS]

Only fitting that the Mets and Phils get no-hit on the same night

[PhillyBlunt]

nice montage on CSN: Seven strike outs, all on balls out of the strike-zone and low. Ruiz just strikes out on a five pitch at-bat where he didn't see a single strike. I've never seen a pitcher get a no-hitter going this deep while throwing 70% of all his pitches outside of the zone. And we have only one walk?

[clout]

NEPP: You're famous for clueless posts, but you may have outdone yourself on this one:

"This was a guy that should have been grateful for a major league invite type contract let alone a guaranteed 2.5 million plus major incentives. He won't be missed."

You have noticed his value in the bullpen, right?

[EastFallowfield]

Isn't it traditional when there's a no hitter that the defense has to make one or two tricky plays? We can't even do that.

[heycholly]

how about majewski?

couldn't be any worse than taschner or walker??

[Alex]

This team is truly pathetic.

[heycholly]

tmac has a real grasp there- 'phillies not producing a lot of offense' well duh...

[NEPP]

I'm famous now? Okay.

I'm venting clout, not trying to make completely accurate posts. I don't care how good he's been out of the pen so far (arguable) His constant whining about being a starter and our stupid promise to give him a shot have been a big part of screwing the pitching staff for the first 2.5 months.

[bay_area_phan]

With all due respect, those who are advocating that we "play for 2010" are talking gibberish. I'm probably the single most pessimistic poster on this entire board, but I'm able to separate my pessimism from my pragmatic side. Do I think the Phillies are going to be 2009 WFC? No. Do I think they're going to win the East? No. Do I think they're going to make the playoffs? No. Do I think they're going to finish with a winning record? Honestly, we're so bad right now that I wouldn't bet on it.

But, of course, I would have given the same answers at this time last year. Our predictions should not dictate how the Phillies approach the trade deadline. The window of opportunity isn't going to last forever and you never know how the season is going to play out. If you are in first place, or near first place, you are a buyer. That doesn't mean selling the farm, but it does mean being willing to give up some good prospects in order to try to improve the team for the here and now.

[denny b.]

The Mets had a 3 error inning earlier tonight.

The NL East is just plain brutal right now.

Everybody just needs to take a deep breath right now. You would hope this is the lowest the team can get right now. They were in a similar bad stretch at this time last year, with many of the same people sucking.

They'll get out of it, somehow. Might just take a trip to their favorite place to play (Turner Field) to get them righted again. It certainly worked last year, whenever they needed a pick-me up.

Of course, Atlanta is a much better team this year.

[NEPP]

Not that its the greatest indicator for a reliever but Park has posted a DOMINANT 4.15 ERA out of the pen so far. Truly worth 2.5 million when we could probably get the equivalent effort from a Koplove type of $390 K reliever.

[NEPP]

I'm not saying throw the season. My biggest fear is a huge panic move by a first year GM to show that he's "just as good as Gillick was". Something stupid like Drabek, Taylor and Brown for Gil Meche or something of similar ridiculousness.

[G-Town Dave]

Thank You, Chase!!!!!! :-D

[Knight]

At least it won't be a no hitter. The embarrassment won't be complete.

[heycholly]

we win - we got a hit

oops still losing 4-0

oh snap...

[NEPP]

Also, going into tonight, Park has allowed 4 of 7 inherited runners to score. He's been a fantastic reliever, clout.

[PS]

NEPP:

Definitely some validity to your post about Amaro. Other GMs know he's a first-year guy, and they're going to hold off until close to the deadline just in case he does panic.

Maybe the reason the Phils haven't been able to acquire any of the guys they have been rumored to be getting for two months.

The Indians did it to Minaya when he was in Montreal. (Cliff Lee, Sizemore, Brandon Phillps for Bartolo Colon).

[Alex]

I was hoping for a no hitter to embarrass this team even further.

[bay_area_phan]

Most of that 4.15 ERA came in one game. Other than that, he has been pretty solid in relief. Actually, he has been the only half-way decent reliever we've had over the last month or so.

All the Koplove love is a bit zany. Koplove hasn't been an effective major league pitcher in 5 years yet, to hear it told on this site, he would have been able to step right in and be one of the top relievers in baseball. Before he was called up, Tyler Walker was getting the same love that Koplove was getting. Then we finally call him up and guess what? He sucks. What a shock.

[denny b.]

Carrasco through 4 innings:

4 hits, 0 ER, 2 BB's and 4 K's (all swinging).

Cruised through the 3rd, but ran into trouble in the 4th. Induced a inning-ending DP with the bases loaded to get out of it.

CC supposedly has a wicked good curveball tonight.

[NEPP]

BAP, I'ms simply using Koplove as an example of a low-cost option (one of dozens that were available as opposed to Park in the off-season. I'd have rather they'd gotten Cruz (and sacrificed the draft pick) for the same cost.

[GBrettfan]

Scoring runs for this team lately is like climbing Mt. Everest.