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Posted by J. Weitzel at 08:43 PM | Permalink
Sources state that it will be one of the most expensive surgeries in recent history with an estimated cost of approximately $30-40 million over the next few years.
I predict a panic trade by Rube in 5,4,3,2...
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 08:51 PM
I would say let the young guys step up - but we just locked up pretty much every single impact player on our entire roster for the next 3 seasons, so its obviosuly win now mode, and that means go get someone who will help in the next 3 years, not in next 10.
if we didnt have everyone all locked up for those years than I would be all for siting back and letting our youngin's take care o business for better or worse...but thats just not the situation the Phils have put themselves in.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 08:55 PM
The hip surgery is hip. Tommy John is so uncool.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:00 PM
"mobily" isn't a word.
Brian G |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:04 PM
""mobily" isn't a word."
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:12 PM
I just hope that Amaro doesn't use this as an excuse to keep going with the guy who has the worst ERA in MLB, Jamie Moyer. If Amaro was looking for a starter before Myers' injury, he ought to be looking for two now. Bastardo certainly deserves a shot, but Amaro needs to get the afterburner going fast on a deal for a quality starter, as opposed to just another fungible POS who will work for a couple hotdogs and a beer. They certainly have the trading goods to snad Bedard.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:22 PM
Typo. snad = snag.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:27 PM
Hitman: Read the Jayson Stark article. Moyer won't be replaced for a while yet.
p. Red |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:29 PM
Hey those Iron Pigs beat up on Mets AAA hurlers Ollie Perez, Jon Nease and Nelson Figeuroa this week.
Swept them, with Carpenter, Kendrick and Bastardo all pitching effectively. And Miggy Cairo was ON FIRE, with the stick.
Go Pigs Go! Take that Mets bloggers!!!
Seriously... Dom Brown with 3 more knocks tonight at Clearwater. Now hitting .340 for the year.
I would hate to give up either him or Taylor in ANY deal, for ANY pitcher.
denny b. |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:31 PM
Bedard is the guy to get. Peavy and Oswalt cost way too much money in the next few years, regardless of the prospect cost. Bedard will be a FA after the year, which means you can probably get him relatively cheaply (one top prospect like Carrasco, Donald, Marson, plus a couple low-level guys as a guess, but who knows), he doesn't affect the payroll very much or lock you in long-term, and he will walk at the end of the year and net you 2 draft picks, which we could use after losing our top pick this year.
If I'm Amaro, Bedard is the guy I'd go after.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:33 PM
Denny B: I will be very disappointed if they trade either Taylor or Brown, though probably more angry about trading Brown. I think he's going to be an all-star, and is an elite prospect. Since Werth is only signed through next year, and Ibanez is 37, I would not be surprised at all to see Brown and Taylor in the outfield by 2011.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:36 PM
Myers made his own bed by ignoring a pesky injury. He's done with the Phils after this year anyway so go large and get a no. 2 starter. No choice here.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:37 PM
Brian: it sounds better than "posted from an open bar"
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:42 PM
Sigh. It was nice knowing you Lou Marson...
Joel Goods |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:52 PM
I don't know if Myers "made his own bed" with this injury especially given the fact that he actually came into camp this year in shape for a change instead of drinking beers/eating fried food in the offseason.
Myers is he probably done in a Phils' uniform though. Very interesting to see how will be remembered here if that is the case but I bet is it largely a mixed bag - a guy who had a few good seasons but also underachieved nearly as much.
Frankly, the fan base largely seems to like him but I have always found it difficult to root for him because of the wife-beating incident, his general lack of preparation off the field, and his mental shortcomings on it.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:55 PM
2010 NL Comeback Player Of The Year: St Louis Cardinal pitcher Brett Myers
Kool Earl |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 09:57 PM
On the last thread, Denny said that Bastardo reminded him of Odalis Perez. The post reminded me that the real Odalis Perez is still unclaimed -- which I find a bit odd, since he was a perfectly average starting pitcher last year and few teams can claim to have 5 guys in their rotation who are better than average.
It's not like I'm a huge fan of Odalis Perez, but he would give you about what Jason Marquis would give you, only for a lot cheaper & without having to give up any prospects. Let's remember: the Phillies needed a starting pitcher BEFORE Myers got injured. Now they need 2. It's hard enough to pull off one trade for a starting pitcher; they sure aren't likely to pull off 2. With less than stellar options in their minor league system, they might consider looking at the best available free agent, and that is probably Perez.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:04 PM
Actually, I think Myers' injury, assuming it keeps him out most of the rest of the season, increases the chance he'll be in red pinstripes in 2010 (albeit on a one-year deal, which probably suits the Phils well).
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:10 PM
Yep, Moyer will be hard to get out of the rotation, BUT he can't keep getting his ass kicked game after game. If he is plastered every outing, it won't take long until he effectively retires. There is no getting around the fact that it will cost the Phils at least the $13 million in base pay, but that is Amaro's problem for making a stupid deal.
All of this support for Moyer from Cholly reminds me of when George McGovern ran for President (am I showing my age?), and his VP choice was Thomas Eagleton. It was then learned that Eagleton had had an emotional problem for which he received psychiatric help. The clamor arose to dump Eagleton from the ticket, but McGovern famously said:"I am behind Tom Eagleton 1000 percent." The next week he dumped Eagleton. That's what's going to happen to Moyer.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:19 PM
This is the situation I feared going into '09. 'What would happen if one our top starters go down?' Well...we're about to find out. Peavy? Oswalt? Webb, who's still on the DL? The bigger long shot that I'd love to see is Doc Halladay. The term "innings-eater" is thrown around too often with the pampered starters of today's game. Halladay consistently goes 7,8, and throws complete games at his best. I feel like the Phils have to give the most to get Doc, but he'd be so valuable behind Hamels. I can hear the Bullpen writing their July Christmas lists to Santa.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:30 PM
Hitman: Who replaces Moyer & Myers in the rotation?
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:30 PM
If the Phillies play this situation right, this Myers injury could be a blessing. It's so early in the season, insurance will probably pay about $9millon of his salary. That gives the Phillies the flexibility to add a pitcher that makes some money.
I would go after Bedard. Peavy is'nt coming here, and even if he would, it would cost 77mil over the next 4 years. Ed Wade is not going to trade Oswalt to the Phillies after giving them a WS with the Lidge deal. Bedard makes the most sense. Has pitched well on the east coast in a band box. Is a good #2 pitcher when healthy. Let Seattle from choose 2 or 3 of Marson, Donald, Bastardo and Kendrick(Washington product).
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:31 PM
clout - Nobody in the interim. More and more after thinking about it I would be stunned if the Phils don't try to stopgap this internally until closer to the trading deadline and the reluctance of teams to dump a starting pitcher before the ASB.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:35 PM
Why are we assuming that the Phillies will get any insurance on Myers? Insurance premiums for players have gone through the roof, and I've never seen any indication that the Phillies have any players covered. If this isn't the case, could someone produce a link showing that we have such policies?
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:36 PM
clout's point is key, filling two holes is the key. I can't imagine under any circumstance that we'd put 4 southpaws in the rotation. Hamels isn't going anywhere, nor is Happ unless we are getting a total stud pitcher. Charlie will stick with Moyer until Moyer quits on him, and I don't see that happening.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:42 PM
I don't think a move is coming this week. We'll see someone called up but a trade is definitely coming.
I think Webb is an intriguing possibility. Arizona is not making the playoffs and supposedly they have serious financial issues. He's reportedly out until maybe the All Star break, but his salary is only $6.5 million with an $8.5 million option for 2010. That's not bad for at all for a guy of his skill level.
But in all reality, I think Bedard is the most likely to actually end up in pinstripes.
Steve Jeltz |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:43 PM
mikes77: Do we have any reason to believe the M's want to trade Bedard? I'd think they'd want to re-sign him since their biggest weakness is pitching.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:44 PM
Bedard would also give them a rotation with 4 lefties.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:46 PM
The pitching moves available to the Phillies right now are few and far between. To land a superstar, you'd have to part with not only a major league bat (Werth/Victorino), but a lot of the top-level talent in the minors that we've been grooming for the next 2-3 years. It's a tough call.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:46 PM
4 years, 77 million for Peavy? Where exactly did that number come from? According to Cot's Contracts, Peavy makes 11 this year, 15 in 2010, 16 in 2011, and 17 in 2012, with a 4 million dollar buyout for 2013. That makes 63 million over 4 years. The actual value is less because he's already been paid approximately 3 million of this year's salary.
If the Phillies were to pick up his 2013 option, then you get a number closer to 77 million, but that would be over 5 years.
Maybe I'm missing something, but I'm just curious where that 4 year/77 million number came from.
I second MPN's comment about insurance. Is it common for teams to insure players against injury? I've never heard of this regarding Myers until reading it several times on this thread.
DH Phils |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:48 PM
4daysrest- Agreed. The Phils would have to likely part not only with some top-talent talent in the minors but also at least 1 piece on the MLB team that is signed to a reasonable contract ala Werth/Vic/Madson.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:49 PM
MG: Madson - don't even say that!
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:51 PM
This sucks indeed, but what can ya do. I think Myers will push hard to keep playing through the pain. Heck, i would take a 4.5 ERA out of him if hes injured for the year.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:54 PM
johnnysanz3 - you'd be lucky to get a 4.5 out of him if he's healthy.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:56 PM
clout: All trade talk is speculation. I don't know why(or believe) Houston would trade Oswalt or Toronto would trade Halladay. That has'nt kept their names off of MLBTR. My thougt is that the Mariners did'nt get what they thought when they traded all of those good prospects for Bedard. They should want to replace some of their farm system losses since they are'nt going to win this year. Even if Bedard pitches well for them the rest of the year, he will command Fort knox next year, and they still won't be ready to win. I believe they have more incentive to trade Bedard than to keep and sign him.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:58 PM
Funny how baseball conventional wisdom can go right out the window. Remember how starting pitching depth looked like a Phils strong point this spring?
Kool Earl |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 10:58 PM
mikes77: That's possible, but until I read it from someone covering the team, the most likely scenario is that they're keeping Bedard as part of their foundation. He's only 30.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:02 PM
If Myers goes on the DL, what are the chances that we see Chan Ho Park back in the rotation?
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:03 PM
rjm08: hopefully, slim to none.
I'd rather they trot out Worley, Bastardo, Carpenter, Kendrick, and Carrasco all out for auditions than move CHP back to the rotation.
Steve Jeltz |
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:08 PM
clout: We don't KNOW that Bedard is available, but it has been widely speculated that he is -- and for good reason. It's pretty standard for non-contending teams (i.e., Seattle) to trade away players who have value and are in their walk year (i.e., Bedard), so that they can get something for that player. If the Mariners want Bedard as part of their future, there would be nothing to stop them from trading Bedard, getting something in return, and then signing him when he hits the FA market. Unless the Mariners think they can contend this year, I think Bedard will be traded before 7-31.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:09 PM
Listening to Ike Reese talk about baseball is painful. Keep talkin Eagles because you don't bring anything to the table on baseball.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:10 PM
What are the chances that Everyday Clay and Durbin both experience a notable dead arm period/ineffectivness by August? I bet those odds just increased a bit.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:12 PM
Hitman gets on here and bashes Moyer everyday. It isn't like his velocity is down; he gets squeezed, falls behind, and becomes predictable. With a good strike-zone he's effective. And there is no pitcher who can get back in to form better--and quicker--than Moyer. His last two starts went well, after all.
How many times have people written his obituary already in his career?
And for the record, Mr. Hitman, Eagleton went through, and concealed, the fact that his "psychiatric" treatment was electric-shock therapy, which was already known at the time to cause retardation and loss of mental faculties (Cuckoo's Nest?). Not to mention his drug regimen rivaled Charles Manson and Hannibal Lecter.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:18 PM
His last two starts went well? They were tolerable, I suppose, from a fifth starter. It's pretty discouraging that they're his best outings this season. As for the strike zone, I don't see that changing.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:40 PM
What I don't understand is this perception that I got from DNL and others today is that Myers has been a hard worker his entire career?
I certainly buy the "wants to pitch on the mound even in pain" argument but when has Myers ever (with the exception of this offseason) been credited with being a guy who puts in any kind of real prepartion in the offseason or between starts?
Hell, if anything Myers has generally done little to nothing in the offseason to prepare in previous years and didn't Dubee publicly rip Myers just last year in April for being a knucklehead who didn't follow advice including long-tossing between starts to keep up his arm strength.
Myers may play through pain but I would generally say that he has been indifferent at best when it comes to preparation/conditioning and more likely lazy & coasted on his very talented natural ability much of the time.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:50 PM
Tray - Agreed. This notion that Moyer is getting squeezed this year is largely bunk. He just doesn't have the pin-point control he needs and all of his peripheals numbers show that including a very weak 1.63 K/BB ratio.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:53 PM
If Myers is out for a while, I think the Phils call up Bastardo. He's 23, so he's not TOO young, has pitched well at all levels of the minors, strikes people out, and has a substantially improved walk rate this year. He pitched tonight (7IP, 6H, 0R, 1BB, 1SO) so he can slide right into Myers' slot. This doesn't preclude the Phils making a trade down the line, but I think the kid gets a shot with the big club first.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:55 PM
PhillyBlunt, How about a reality check. Assume that each of the 30 teams has 5 starting pitchers. That's 150 pitchers. Who among the 150 has the highest ERA? And you are still on the Moyer bandwagon. What would it take to change your mind if you are defending the least effective starter in MLB? And thanks for the lesson on the effects of electroshock. For your information, it does not cause "retardation and loss of mental faculties." The procedure is still used today. It often results in disorientation and perhaps some minor memory loss. My point, however, was less about electroshock than about McGovern's "1000 percent" support for a guy he dumped the next week. The Phils will swear their support of Moyer up to the day they cut him. It's sad because he is an icon, but they don't need an icon, they need somebody who can get a few batters out.
Thursday, May 28, 2009 at 11:57 PM
MG wrote in the last thread: "The question is if Bastardo does get called up what do the fans come up with for him in LF? Bastardo's Boys, Illegiminate Ones, . . ."
That's easy: Lucky Bastardos.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 12:08 AM
Clout: While I have seen wide speculation that Bedard will be traded, I haven't seen one suggestion that the Mariners will try and sign him to a long-term deal as a FA. Where did you see that?
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 12:12 AM
PB: An alternate explanation: the reason Moyer falls behind in counts is not because he's getting squeezed, but because he's 46 and is starting to lose the fine motor skills required to paint the corners. And his last 2 starts "went well," only in comparison to the 3 before them, in which he allowed 19 earned runs in just over 12 innings. Only in an alternate reality does a 6-inning, 4-run performance -- against a team he has absolutely owned -- constitute a good start.
Moyer has basically had 9 bad game, and only 1 good one, in his past 11 starts. Unless you think he got squeezed in 10 of those 11 games, there is something else going on.
Both the Phillies and their fans have convinced themselves that, because Moyer is a control pitcher, he can pitch into eternity.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 12:31 AM
Its hard to tell if Bastardo's drop in walks is real or not. It's certainly possible, at his age, for such a drop to happen, but he's been wild his entire career before this. I think the fact that Amaro & co. were at Worley's starts point to him possibly getting the call. It isn't hard to blame them either. His career 55.9% GB rate would put him 6th in the majors, his 1.27 BB/9 would put him 4th. Now it's very realistic to expect those ratios to get worse when going from the minors to the majors, but keeping the ball on the ground and not walking anyone is a recipe for success.
Dave X |
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 12:39 AM
Also, we all know Cholly is never going to publicly throw a player under the bus -- especially a player like Moyer. But I think it's prett clear that, behind the scenes, the Phillies are seriously worried. After all, Myers' injury only occurred yesterday, yet we've been reading for a good week or 10 days that the Phillies are actively inquiring about seemingly every starting pitcher who might be available. Unless you think they're looking to replace Happ, why else would they be making inquiries about a starter unless they're at least starting to entertain the possibility that Moyer might be finished?
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 12:43 AM
Whoever gets the call-up -- my bet is Carpenter -- he'll have a chance to get an instant jolt of confidence because he'll be making his first start in the pitcher's paradise of Petco Park. Unfortunately, he'll probably have Jake Peavy opposing him.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 12:50 AM
sounds like its time to crack open the piggy bank and spend some schekels for an outstanding arm.
hopefully, management believes winning is good for business, but if past is prelude, typical philadephia sports team management are cheapskates who hope lowly paid, bargin basement players blossom into all-stars once they come to philly... they usually don't.
we all know the reason philly had not had a championship for three and a half decades, its that cheapskate management did not want to fork over the money for the best players.
current philly management was no different during this past off season with a j burnett and derek lowe available.
they'll likely think that they can get another pete gray and pay him half priced since he'd only have one arm.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 01:36 AM
They have been seemingly trying to trade for Bedard for a few years. So it would make sense, they give it another shot with the M's. He also probably wouldn't cost as much, in prospects.
Webb would also be a perfect fit for CBP. And his contract isn't bad either. Arizona's going nowhere and having financial troubles, so that could be someone to go after. His injury though, could be the deal-breaker.
They are going to pick up someone. That seems to be a lock, at this point. But, I think it would be a waste of time, to bring a Jason Marquis-type in (or a Joe Blanton-type). They need someone steady that they can put with Hamels at the top of the rotation.
I think the Phils are very worried now, about Moyer. I don't know what they can do though. One thing for sure...after his start against Washington on Sunday; his next start will likely be against Los Angelas. We have all seen that movie play out before and its been really ugly for Jamie against LA. I don't see him lasting much longer in the rotation, if he gets shelled again in LA and is only adequate against Washington. It will be time to move on with a youngster from the minors and stash Jamie on the DL for a while. I agree with all of those things said in the article today about him. But its still about winning games and getting the job done with the best guys you can put out there; sentimentality aside.
The Mets farm system is barren right now, and the Braves are under financial restraints, so the Phils have to strike now and get the front-line starter they need. They know what they need; and they seem like they want to get it. They finally should have plenty of ammunition to get it done. And those contracts coming off the books next year (Jenkins, Eaton, possibly Myers and Moyer if he retires) help the situation for the FO to take on extra money for 2/3 of the season.
BTW, the Braves have a absolute stud starting pitching prospect (Tommy Hanson) at AAA who has been near unhittable this year. I would look for him to be up soon; giving them (on paper) the best rotation in the division (Lowe, Vazquez, Jurrjins, Kawakami and Hanson). If they can keep Chipper healthy and possibly add an arm to the bullpen, they are going to be right there down the stretch.
denny b. |
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 02:53 AM
For now, I would rather see a call-up (Preferably Bastardo) and keep KK, Carrasco, and Carpenter in the chamber should we have to replace Moyer which I know is unlikely any time soon.
Does KK still have trade value? Could we get away with trading him instead of a top prospect?
As for what pitchers are out there, what about Penny? would the BoSox want to trade with us? Seems like he would be a much cheaper alternative than Peavy, Oswalt, or Bedard. I don't want Washburn, Davis, or Marquis.
Going to be an interesting few weeks.
ftl John |
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 02:53 AM
Kuvasz, that's just stupid. Did you look at any numbers before writing that? The phillies "cheap" management commited 186 million dollars this off season to free agents and contract extensions. That's second to only the yankees 441 million, and in front of the third largest spending team, the dodgers, by 80 million dollars.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 03:05 AM
look for Bastardo or Vance Worley to make their debut soon. My guess is Bastardo, he hasn't had a problem in 2 starts for the Iron Pigs of Death Valley (for prospects) - get him the heck out of their before it is too late. Problem is then 4 of your 5 starters are pitching from the left side, that is why I think they may surprise everyone and go with Vance Worley. By the way go get Mark derosa and let Bruntlett go. He was huge for the Cubs last year
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 03:12 AM
as for trades. Peavy is too expensive. I figure the next best would Oswalt, Bedard and Cliff Lee are possibles but they are all left-handed. Oswalt would be expensive but he is who I would get. Ed Wade still knows players but my guess is he would want something off the roster as well and not pitching, I'm thinking Victorino, Carrasco and Donald would be to start. Bedard and Lee could be had for less but Bedard doesn't pitch deep enough into games, we need someone who can go 7-8 innings regularly. my guess, we'll end up with Penney or Marquis soon. What about Roy Holiday? i would back up the truck and offer whatever it takes to get him. Imagine him in the national league, he is exactly what we need. supposedly they are frustrated with Rios - take him too.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 03:32 AM
um, bob. i surely did, but its clear that you did not. so who's calling whom stupid?
the phillies sell out almost every game. they rake in $millions per game in attendence let alone concessions, and souvenirs, and parking, as well as millions in tv and radio rights. they play in the largest metropolitan area with only one team and have no competition for baseball fan dollars. they spend $113 million in '09 on salary and are ranked seventh in payroll.
they trail the yanks, mets, cubs, red sox, tigers, and angels.
and only the cubs and yanks (a half game out of first) are not leading their respective divisons. so its clear that in major league baseball you have to spend to win. get it?
and the phillies just won the WFS. they are proverbially "loaded."
so with that defining the context, who are you, a front office apologist/troll or the ghost of connie mack?
you have to spend the money to win. that's just business 101. if they don't want to spend the money that's going to be their problem, but they will slip behind the teams that do spend the money and phillie fans can wait until 2038 to win another world series.
btw, the yankees spend $200,000,000 and usually win as many world series in a single decade as the phillies have done in their 126 year history. and the reason for that is the cheapness of phillie management through that century and a quarter.
maybe bob, you ought to root for washington nationals. after all, their payroll is less than half of the phillies.
but, as usual you will get what you pay for.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 04:21 AM
Kuvasz: Your figures don't include the salaries owed to Eaton, Jenkins and Thome. The payroll is over $130 million. Zolecki has an entry about this at the following link.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 07:18 AM
its fun to dream but i don't think the phillies have the propsect talent to snag Halladay, Oswalt, or Webb. You're talking about the premier pitchers in baseball and these teams are not about to trade quality for quantity as is frequently proposed here. Donald, Marson, Carrasco, etc., these guys are ok but its going to take a STUD to get an allstar. (Assuming the trade market doesn't go dead and teams don't become crazy desparate)
Obviously never say never but the Phillies will probably trade for a Marquis type talent that reflects the good not excellent prospects they have in the system.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 07:58 AM
For a Bedard or Peavy (or a similar starter), a team can pick 2 from the following list:
- Any AA and AAA pitcher (e.g. Carrasco, Bastardo, Worley, Stutes, Savery, etc.)
+ throw in Quinten Berry, if it helps.
For lesser pitchers, the list obivously gets paired down accordingly.
In all cases, I'm holding on to Taylor, Brown, Drabek and the rest of their A talents (i.e. last two drafts).
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 08:31 AM
"If the Mariners want Bedard as part of their future, there would be nothing to stop them from trading Bedard, getting something in return, and then signing him when he hits the FA market." - BAP
That's assuming he even hits the FA market. The Phillies would have exclusive negotiation rights with Bedard through the rest of the season and into part of the offseason.
That said, let's not kid ourselves into thinking Seattle is going to win the AL West anytime soon. If they get a reasonable offer for Bedard before the deadline, he'll move.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 08:38 AM
I love the name Vance Worley. It sounds like he should be a character in Bull Durham. I can't wait until he announces his presence with authority.
Think of the cool names we would have on the Phils: Cole, Chase, Shane, Vance...
Tony D |
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 08:49 AM
dennyb.: Tim Hudson is due back from the DL in the beginning of August - giving the Braves' best NL East rotation another shot in the arm. I will be very concerned if the Braves are only sitting a game or two back heading into the stretch.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:20 AM
dennyb: "They have been seemingly trying to trade for Bedard for a few years."
Bedard has been on the M's one season.
Jack: There's tons of speculation about tons of players, just as there is every year. And, every year, 95% of those players don't get traded.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:27 AM
Tony D - George Carlin would not agree with you; he longed for the days of Biff, Spud and Cuck.
king myno |
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:29 AM
Bastardo has a low 90s fastball and a nice changeup and has pitched very well in 47 IP so far this season. However, he gave up 13 HR in 67 IP at Reading last year and his career BB/9 is 4.0. The prevailing assumption on Beerleaguer that he can just slide right into the rotation and do what Myers has done strikes me as dubious.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:32 AM
The problem with Moyer is that the best you can possibly ever hope for is 3 runs over 6 innings--and we're talking best case scenario. More often its four, five, or six runs over fewer innings.
That, to me, is awfully discouraging. Even Park was capable of having a game or two where he shut down the opposition. Moyer will never ever hold a team to one or two runs, and usually not three or four runs either. Its not really fair to the offense that every fifth game they know, before a pitch is even thrown, that they have to score a ton of runs.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:43 AM
Adam Eaton is availible....
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:43 AM
clout: denny said 'trade for', meaning the Phillies have been linked to him back in his O's days as well.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:44 AM
thephaithful: Ah, I missed the "for." Thanks.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:48 AM
Clout: I do not disagree with your assessment of Bastardo. What I have read about him is dead-on with your above statement. However, drastic situations (ie the one we're in now -- Myers possibly out, ineffective Park, ineffective Moyer, and question marks with Blanton and Happ) call for drastic measures and I think that "riding the hot hand" may be something to consider. It should by no means be the long term solution. I would rather gamble on Bastardo, who is a tad older, than Someone like Worley.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:49 AM
From Last thread : Someone said Worley might be at best half of Roy Oswalt. I disagree.
Having done the math he is exactly two-thirds of Roy Oswalt. You will have a T an A and an extra O Left over.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:50 AM
Phaithful: I have a feeling Adam Eaton will always be available.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 09:51 AM
Rex - I guess if Vance is called up, we should nickname him "Tao" (as in "the way") and know, then, that he is the equal of Mr. Oswalt.
I'm thinking we trade Blanton to Seattle for Bedard and call up Bastardo, (Disclaimer: this is completely and totally a joke.) that way we can institute the first completely LH starting rotation in MLB history. Bring on Delgado, Bruce, Dunn...we ain't afraid!
That the next time Myers' slot comes up will be in SDP with Peavy scheduled? Makes me wanna send them a package with Kendrick as the most MLB-ready pitcher for him. If Peavy's gonna pitch a game in SD with the Phils involved, why not have him pitch for us?
Ice-9: Worley and Stutes are the draft class of 2008.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 10:09 AM
What's up with Ben Sheets? Is he still a free agent, is he healthy yet?
Willie Mo |
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 10:28 AM
ben sheets will still cost draft picks i believe (at least until sometime in june or july), he's still rehabbing, and from what i recall reading, he has a bit of a handshake agreement with the rangers. but i'm sure if someone wants to jump the gun and throw a contract at him, he'd consider it.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 10:33 AM
Andy: "that way we can institute the first completely LH starting rotation in MLB history."
The A's used an all-lefty rotation for about a month late last season: Dallas Braden, Gio Gonzalez, Greg Smith, Dan Meyer and Dana Eveland.
The closest thing to full season might've been the 1954 Senators: Mickey McDermott, Chuck Stobbs, Johnny Schmitz, Dean Stone and lone righty Bob Porterfield.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 10:38 AM
Andy - Thanks. I'm aware that the guys in AA are also 2008 draftees (Stutes/Worley). I'm saying the young guys from recent drafts in low/hi A impress me and I'd like to hold onto them until we have a better idea of what they are. Their potential likely exceeds their present value. Stutes/Worley now at AA may have value that meets or exceeds their talent. Though I like them both very much, I'm will to move them to get a stud pitcher.
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 10:59 AM
Yo, new thread
Friday, May 29, 2009 at 12:04 PM
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