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Monday, February 23, 2009


Perhaps we could hypnotize him to think he's pitching in Dodger Stadium (2.96 Career ERA there)...

Ho Park in rotation scares me. Ho Park in critical bullpen role scares me. Ho Park in long relief/6th inning I'm cool with.

All the Philly papers just filed for Chapter 11. I've heard from fairly reputable sources that will no longer be a free site in the near future so I'm guessing David Murphy's readership will vastly diminish in favor of Zolecki's somewhat less interesting but FREE blog on


I stopped reading the NY Times when they started to charge for the site.

I'll do the same thing at

I go there for the sports. Anything else I read there is just a function of seeing a link. I don't go there looking for it.

Certainly, the OP-ED page is nothing spectacular or wnlightening, and that kind of content can be accessed for free elsewhere.

It used to be the Inky and DN sports pages were a must read in the morning, especially during the baseball season. Not any more. Not only have they cut back, but the content just isn't as good.

Now, with all the other free content available online, if they start charging they'll be shooting themselves in the foot.

There are too many other places you can get the same information, and in most cases, better analysis.


are just a few.

For "insider" info Scott Lauber's blog is, IMO, the best out there. His daily updates and morning minutes form ST are great. If he keeps this up I wonder how long he'll be in Delalware.

Now, Zolecki is also available elsewhere.

Newspaper circulation is dropping nationwide, so if Tierney and Co. want to start charging for it online, they'll likely make themselves even more irrelevant than they already are.

Now, to address JW's topic on this thread, I hope the competition crucible that they are putting the four competitors through in ST produces a refined 5th starter who can eat about 180 innings and keep the bullpen fresh.

Thinking ahead, it also begs another question:

With three replacements available, how long will they stick with the guy who wins the spot if he happens to falter in April/May?

Journal-Register out of Yardly also announced they were filing for Chapter 11 this weekend. Read it in the Pottstown Mercury, which is a Journal-Register paper.

Not long...not long at all probably. I agree that Lauber is probably the best blogger with "inside" sources for the Phillies.

Lastly, I think we all should have a collective moment of silence this morning, and give thanks that the Phillies; FO is not the unmitigated mess that is the Nats' FO.

Thank God out GM is not Jim Bowden!!!

Can you imagine?

Just FYI, for thise interested in the topic of today's thread, Lauber has the pitching schedule poster on his blog this morning.

I rest my case.

Yeah, Bowden seems like a "classy" guy. How has the Lerner family not fired his dumb arse yet?

Apparently when Tierney's group purchased the paper they put up only 20% in equity while taking on 400 million in debt.

NY Times went back to being free. If they can't charge for content, who can?

I've always thought all the newspapers should figure out a system where you'd pay to get blanket access to them (like cable TV). Of course, antitrust might not allow it. I still go to every AM for sports stories (and to read about which part of Coatesville burned the night before).

EFF: And charge a nickel a story. Your suggestion is along the lines of what the guy from Time Magazine suggested.

Newspapers would benefit from a total overhaul of the internet. Or, the creation of a sub-internet which functions like an app store.

The sad truth is with the now local channels focusing on local sports like the comcast sportsnet's of the world and the 24 hour sports talk radio,there isn't much a need for newspapers. Also.with peoples very busy schedules, I know that any time any place I can go on my blackberry and find the latest news without having to wait to hear the next morning from the paper.

Just to address the topic at hand, I am a little worried concernign the idea that Carrasco could begin his major league time. It seems as if baseball and football will be switching hats soon, and baseball will be the one with a salary cap. Should these even be looked at right now, as the world PH*****G Champs look to build a competitve team for the next few years.

Here are just some of the headlines in today's inq and DN. I am going to preface this by saying that I think we all knew everything about these articles before this morning, so why read?

"Expect some decisions from Eagles this week" - Knew this about brian dawkins and Tra since Saturday via 610.

"Trade deadline nears for Flyers"- knew this also about them trying to upgrade defense and goaltending.

"Carrasco as 5th starter?"- knew this since I think the day after world series per interviews by Amaro on various programs. Article then states he isn't favorite. Again I say no kidding, really?

"I think we all knew everything about these articles before this morning, so why read?"

Sports is a different animal, since it's a subject saturated with coverage. The shame of the decline of newspapers is the potential loss of local news and the community building that results from all of us knowing who is who and what is going on.

Newspapers won't ever go away...they'll just change to a different format. Its not a bad thing, its just progress. Besides, I honestly check a good number of blogs every morning before I go to That's reality.

In case anyone has been following the Soap Opera that is the Nats FO these days: Nationals Just Released (Not DFA'ed, but outright released) SP Odalis Perez. Considering he was basically league average last year (4.34 ERA vs league ERA of 4.38) and left-handed, I'm sure he'll get picked up by someone who needs an okay 4th/5th starter. His WHIP was a bit scary though...and its been really high the past 3 years so I'm amazed his ERA has been as "low" as it has been.

Klaus, you make a good point about local news.

The problem with many of the newspapers, as I see it, is that they, through their editorial and OP-ED editing, alienated a large protion of their readership.

I know conservatives who will not read the NY Times. I also know liberals who think the editorial page of the Wall Street Journal is a facist rag.

Locally, the same can be said for the Inky. Since the proliferation of the internet, many local conservatives don't read it. In their opinion the editorial page is far left, and said editorial policy is reflected in the actual news articles and front page reporting.

Similary, there is a website run by a small group of local college professors dedicated to critiquing the Inky editorials. Now mind you, they criticize the OP-ED page as being too FAR RIGHT!

There is simply no pleasing some people, particularly the extreme idealogues.

I know it's not the first time you've heard the argument they make, and whether anyone agrees with it is irrelevant. The fact is that it is a real phenomenon.

They get their content online, particularly for national and international stories.

Now, to you point about local news: Yes, that is where the real "damage" can occur, as people can lose their connection with their regional communities. Sure they can buy the weekly local paper or a daily paper where it's available and stay connected to their local communities. But, it's the regional connection that will suffer. What happens in Philadelphia affects suberbanites, but the local papers generally steer clear of stories in Philly.

A functioning regional paper benefits all of us, but they're really going to have to get creative to survive in their current form.

I don't live in the area any more. Don't expect breaking news from the AM sports section, which is why if they charged some crazy amount to read it I wouldn't. There's the rub, figuring out if there's a way to charge a small enough fee for content that folks like me would pay for and still bring them enough money to justify doing it.

Looks like the Nats rotation is getting even worse:
Nationals Release Holdout Perez
The final line on Odalis Perez's second stint with the Washington Nationals: zero appearances, zero returned phone calls, zero benefit whatsoever.

Today, the Nationals released Perez, 31, terminating the waiting game that began almost two weeks ago when the left-hander decided not to report to camp. On Feb. 5, Perez had signed a non-guaranteed minor league contract with Washington, a deal that would pay him $850,000 if he made the club. But after Perez signed the deal, he regretted it. He held out for a better deal. He never reported to spring training. He cut off all contact with the team.

ESPN lost me completely when they went nuts with the Insider crap...especially considering both CNNSI and Foxsports don't charge a penny for their sites. Do they really think Jerry Crasnick's insights are that valuable? If I were to pay money for a subscription online it would be for something like Baseball Prospectus or Baseball-Reference. I dont even pay for things like that, let alone something like a newspaper. I'm guessing I'm not that unique in that sentiment.

NEPP, agree. I think ESPN insider crap is exactly that. And I agree that if I pay for anything it would be BP or something like that.

There is simplu too much content available online to pay espn for the "priveledge" of reading authors who are not that insightful in the firat place.

If they were really that smart, how come they don't have better track records predicting division races, playoff series, etc.

To wit, most of these "pundits" picked the Dodgers last season in the NLCS.

None that I read picked the Rays.

Only way Carrasco begins the season with the Phils is if the pitching staff gets plagued by injuries this spring including at least 1 additional starter going down.

NEPP: I don't eat brussels sprouts. Can't stand 'em, wouldn't pay a penny for 'em. I'm guessing I'm not that unique in that sentiment. Same with mint chocolate cookies or ice cream.

Though almost all of them said the Rays were gonna butcher us in the WS...right up until the point we bludgeoned "Cinderella" to death with a big bat.

Adam Eaton is scheduled to pitch on Saturday- maybe we should invite all the Nats scouts to attend.

Yeah, we could trade KK for Ryan Zimmerman straight up. Bowden would go for that, right?

Add some "cash considerations" and you have a deal right up his alley.

last thing.

I believe Tierney when he claims that the newspaper operation is "sound and profitable". The problem of course is the massive, insurmountable debt load. Philadelphia Media holdings hasn't paid a monthly debt payment since June. I wonder if they can even meet the yearly interest.

"Newspapers won't ever go away...they'll just change to a different format."

It's important distinguish news-gathering--a permanent need--from newspapers as institutions. Philadelphia Media Holdings may well someday go away. Same with the Trib, Knight Ridder, etc. Too much debt and limited growth prospects.

But original news-gathering will be forever wanted, and private companies will always exist to deliver it.

MLB network is reporting Mets RHP Tim Redding is reporting soreness in his right shoulder. Speculation is whether he tried to come back too fast from offseason surgery.

That's ashame...I smell a Odalis Perez claim in Omar Minaya's future.

Perhaps some institutions will try the idea touted by Walter Issascon(former Editor of Time), to setup some sort of micro-payment structure, wher you'd pay a couple of cents ecach time to view a page or soemthing along those lines.

The biggest problem is they can't seem to find a way to do it solely through advertising, which makes sense, since in print, your just spreading a wide-net, theres no gurantee to the advertiser that an ad converts to sales, but with web-advertising, they can pay solely for unique visits or click through, as opposed to just for having an ad on a website.

I think the answer really lies in changing the relationship between reporters and media outlets. Reporters may have to shift to being independent contractors as opposed to staff. Public News Broadcasting have always utlized this model, perhaps its time for other news organizations to do the same.

Another idea thats been suggested is to utliize bloggers more, especially for local coverage.

I'm sure the proprietor of this site would have some disagreeements about the practicality of such an idea, but, to me it seems like not a bad idea. How much formal training do you need to cover a school board hearing?

I think, in the end, this is where we will see news gathering get to. Pundits/commentators(political, sports commentary, economists, business journalists etc..) will be paid by various companies/advertisers to do what they do because people want to here their opinion.

I think news-gathering will be done by at large, independent journalists, and most local coverage will be done by citizens journalists, moderated by a staff of professionals.

It's a brave new world.

Who doesn't love beerleaguer?
I remember years ago, we speculated if any Philly pundits read the site. Obviously that question has been answered.
The Zo Zone dovetails ESPN's Insider blogs (linking to outside sources) with the access generated from traditionalistic reporter-organization dynamic.
Beerleaguer's rise epitomizes the media's transition perfectly. MLB figured out that blogs--and free blogs, at that--were really the place where the action happens. Why feed information through the Inky when you can feed it though in-house sources, collect what revenue there is for themselves, and let the chips fall where they may on the "analysis" side of the game.

The HuffPo, Politico, and the Drudge Report are exactly the same as Beerleaguer. Same niche, same success stories. I am loving the newsies' swan song, it all gets better from here.

Has anybody ever gathered less interest on BeerLeaguer than Chan Ho Park?

If Park actually wins the 5th starter spot (and I still think he is the favorite unless he pitches poorly in spring training), then it creates a domino effect because it opens two spots in the bullpen with Romero's suspension.

Given that I doubt Kendrick (or even Happ) open the season in the bullpen if they don't win the starter's spot, then it likely that an unlikely candidate makes at least one bullpen spot.

Call me crazy but a middle relief corp of XX, XX, Durbin, Condrey, and Eyre doesn't exactly wow me. In fact, I would say that it is very possible if this scenario plays out that the middle relief might even be a weakness for the first 2 months of the season.

Comments now set at 100 per page. Working on getting more from Typepad. Praise god.

"Has anybody ever gathered less interest on BeerLeaguer than Chan Ho Park?"

You make a good point! Thank heavens we have Pedro Feliz to make up for it.

Good news, JW.

You know, I think Feliz's glove more than made up for his lack of bat...


"100 per page"

Thank you; and thanks for the warning.

clout - Brussels sprouts are wonderful. Steamed and then sauted with walnuts in walnut oil (a pinch of sea salt) and they become a perfect accompaniment even for Kool-aid. Once again, you are, quite simply, wrong.

NEPP - It would be pretty confusing, next Fall, if we had to wonder which O. Perez was going to suck on a particular day during the inevitible Met collapse.

And, NEPP, maybe Minaya could work some of that trade magic of his and send about four prospects to Cleveland for Oneli Perez (AAA RP). Then we'd really be confused.

"MLB network is reporting Mets RHP Tim Redding is reporting soreness in his right shoulder. Speculation is whether he tried to come back too fast from offseason surgery."

Redding had surgery to repair a stress fracture on his toe. Linking it to his shoulder soreness is a stretch at best.

The fact that Park making another 2 million in performance bonuses should completely erase him from the rotation.

Even if Park is better than Happ and Kendrick this spring, is he gonig to be $2mil better? And just as MG pointed out, it'll also create a big hole in the pen.

The risk of paying extra and losing bullpen depth has to be outweighed by chopark's superiority over both Kendrick and Happ. In a month of spring training, I do not believe its logical to think Park can do that.

I just like the "Ho" part of Chan's name.

Two points today about Ryan Howard.

The first one is actually more a point about batting average. In 2008, Ryan Howard hit .251. A year earlier he had hit .268. In the two years, though, he got a hit when he came to the plate at almost exactly the same rate.

I don't really think the sports coverage has anything to do with newspapers failing. The idea that the Internet can cover a fragmented, niche-filled audience much better than newspapers holds a little water, but lets not forget that part of this story is simply that the papers have done a bad job. They saw the success of Fox News (or were simply purchased by Rupert Murdoch) and after 9-11 chased that audience. Even the "liberal" NY Times and Washington Post shifted towards the right and filled their papers with a bunch of uncritical stenography of the Bush administration's biggest lies for the last eight years. But as it turns out, that audience would rather watch Fox News and not read newspapers, while the younger left-leaning audiences got fed up and fled to the blogs. I know this isn't a political blog, so I'll stop there, but I think thats part of the story here.


you are correct: this is not a political blog. you are incorrect: everything else you typed.

people won't pay for content if it's littered with ads, and i'm quite sure there's more money to be made by better placed and more appropriate ads on a free than a subscription service.

politics has little to do with the failure of print media.

Andy, my first reaction when given the choice of being stabbed in the throat with a fork or eat a plate of brussel sprouts is to ask: "How big is the fork?"

drew, I think you need to read the story.

Redding himself said the offseason surgery on his foot caused him to delay his throwing program.

Hence, he overdid it once he started throwing.

Therefore, the surgery had an direct effect on his shoulder.

Read the article - you'll see.

I'm drinking Andy's brussel sprout flavor-aid, too. Brussel sprouts are delicious. That is all.

Oh wait, um, Chan Ho Park as the 5th starter makes babies cry. Proven fact.

I doubt there was this much debate over politics and industry banter when candlemakers started losing business once the lightbulb was invented, dont know why there is such for newspaper.

AWH - Forget the fork. The real test is whether you'd rather eat Brussels sprouts or watch Adam Eaton pitch as the fifth starter for the Phils.

phaithful - Brussels sprouts are very good by candle-light, too.

Brussels sprouts without butter? But why?

Did I understand clout to say he doesn't like mint chocolate cookies or ice cream? I've never heard of that before.

Chan Ho Park.

(I just realized that I got very far off the topic of the thread; so...)

I wonder if they eat Brussels sprouts in Korea, you know, where Chan Ho Park is from.

(I feel much better now.)

Chan Ho Park.

phargo - I've heard they're good with brown butter; but frankly, after sauteing them with walnuts (or pine-nuts!) in walnut oil (I recommend Roland), I have never gone back to just butter. (And, of course, I do add some butter to the saute, but not so early that it burns.)

Holy buckets! Andy infected me! Just for typing my post after his, it posted in bold font.


Okay, I am cutting me off now, sorry, as you were.


You know it's the off season when I begin messing up my HTML tags. It's like tradition.

Jeltzie, if you, Andy and I are ever at dinner together and I am served brussel sprouts, you are welcome to have mine.

I would rather swallow my own vomit.

I have a sentimental attachment to newspapers, but I was born in the late 70s, so my entire childhood was free of the internet. It seems pretty much inevitable that once more and more of that sentimentality fades, we will be left with the realization that it is an outdated medium. Sad, but true.

As for the 5th starter, if Park makes it, does it make sense to fill those last two spots with questionable relievers until JC gets back? or will Charlie go with just one and an extra position player (maybe Donald or Stairs if he is not traded).

Andy, that is an UNFAIR and loaded question.

If you were a true Phillies fan you would never ask another true fan whether he/she would rather east the one of most repulsive culinary items on the planet or watch Adam Eaton pitch.

What you asking is whether I prefer eatin' sprouts or Eaton crap.

It's basically the same thing.

66 comments and no next link?

sanz - Read the thread. Jason got us 100.

AWH - Being a true Phils fan is all about making those hard choices.

The fact of the matter is, even if Park begins the season in the bullpen, teams always need replacement starters. Assuming Happ wins, which I believe would be optimal, would they go to Park, Kendrick, or Carrasco in event of injury? I imagine if Carrasco is lighting up AAA again they would go with him, but otherwise we'll probably be seeing some Park starts regardless of who wins the 5th starter job.

Also, under Patriot Act XVIII, keeping blog comments bolded will be considered illegal.

The thing with papers is this:

1) They are instantly out of date by the time they are published. Stories are put to bed by 5p day before or 10p, 11p for a late night story. There is no possible way that they can update the paper after its out, so the morning update has to be gotten somewhere else.

2) Production and distribution is obscenely expensive with paper and ink.

thephaithful: Good point. Same with radios and movies when they were put out of business by TV. Technology marches on. It's a shame you can only find candles, radios and movies in a museum now.

Ahh 100 threads now. I see

I don't like Brussel sprouts at all but, I'll eat them over vomit, my own or yours. The internet is great for the latest news, blogs, and finding what you want. It's also got lots of porn, which I hear some people like. The paper is good for reading long stories, editorials and less time-sensitive stuff. Plus, you can see all the box scores at a glance. And, you can take it on teh train or in the sh!tter. I hope we have some version of the paper for a long time to come.

Incidentally, phargo, infected?

It sounds stuff that gets spread in various bars in South Dakota. All I did was mess up an HTML tag.

Oh, but, really:
Chan Ho um Park.

I really am not too worried about who wins the 5th starter spot.

Reason: After last season's WFC Charlie and Dubbee have earned my trust. I believe they will make the right decision for the team as a whole.

The one thing I am concerned about is CH Parks's attitude if he is sent to the 'pen for the good of the overall team and he believes he pitched well enough to earn the 5 spot.

What good does a disgruntled middle reliever who's heart is not in it do for the team? That is one risk. OTOH, if one of the other three clearly outpitches Park, then I don't think he'll be a problem.

The other risk is discouraging KK or Happ if they feel they've pitched well enough to win the spot but get sent to the 'pen or AAA.

It will be interesting in seeing how it all plays out, but based on their track record last season when they handled Brett Myers' situation, I'll give Charlie and Rich the benefit of the doubt.

Hugh - You can also wrap a cleaned whole trout, wrap it in a section of newspaper, tape it with masking tape and soak the entire thing; then bake it at about 350 for, like 20 minutes. It poaches beautifully, and often, when you unwrap it, the skin sticks to the paper and peels right away. It's better if you don't use the comic section though. Not sure if the color in the picture is good for you.

Brussels sprouts, incidentally, are very high in protein and complex carbohydrates. They are perfect with that trout and a decent scoop of brown rice.

The one thing I am concerned about is CH Parks's attitude if he is sent to the 'pen

Oh, c'mon, AWH; these guys are professionals. They wouldn't let being moved from starter to reliever or vice versa effect their motivation. At least no one on the Phils would, right?

UH OH!!!

I don't like this one bit.

The Phillies' bullpen is going to be featured in a new reality series on MLB network calle "The Pen".


Maybe I'm overreacting and not giving them enough credit, but I son't like the distraction something like that can cause.

Andy: That's the best possible use of a newspaper and you can also, instead of baking it, drop the newspaper-wrapped fish on the doorstep of an enemy.

No, one on the Phillies roster would ever get upset.

The Sprting News has their Phillies preview up:

Phillies Preview

For what it's worth, their picking the Phils to repeat as NL East winners.

Mets preview tomorrow.

clout - Forget the doorstep. It's far better to slip it under the front seat of their car.


In the Summer.


During a heat wave.


The day after they've gone on vacation.


So I've heard...

"Chan Ho Park is still very intriguing... No matter how bad he's been, he always gets signed. He has a legion of believers. There's something in the name, and there's something about the aggressive way in which the deal went down..."

Could you elaborate? What is this something in the name? What's intriguing about him?

Andy...your real name wouldn't be Max Goldman, would it?

clout, hows that Ace of Base cassette tape treatin' ya?

oh nevermind, the museum doesn't have cassette players on display, so that means they must still be relevant.

Sporting News preview:

"Howard arguably is baseball's most productive hitter when he is on a roll. Cappello estimates Howard has been on a roll for 70 percent of his career. In his hot streaks (loosely defined as any stretch of games without consecutive 0-fers), Howard has hit .334 while hitting homers at a pace of 67 over 600 at-bats. In his cold streaks: .160 on a 19-homer and 242-strikeout pace for 600 at-bats."

I wonder how much this varies from other hitters and when those "cold streaks" (0-fers) come. My bet is that a bunch of them have come in April and the first week of May.

Question is does the Big Man's bat slumber again this year in April? I say yes.

I'm sure clout will be pleased to note that Kendrick is SN's projected 5th starter.

thephaithful: Another museum piece! And pianos! When radio came along, they were made obsolete. That's why you'll never see a house with a piano in it.

I share AWH's concerns regarding possibly alienating whatever pitchers don't win that fifth starter spot. Especially Park, since he seems to really feel, seemingly erroneously, that its his to lose.

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