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Monday, July 28, 2008

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Happ was pulled from his start before Eaton's implosion...just sayin'.

I'd DFA him outright personally. On Seanez, who would replace him? There's no one in the minors who I'd trust for the role and until Gillick rummages through the waiver scrapheap I see little point to getting rid of him. Besides its nice to have a UFC contender on the bench in case of on field brawls.

Tell why again, the game start wasn't delayed for an hour or two to avoid the 100% chance of rain? In the end it helped the Phillies, as the disjointed game forced both teams to their bullpens early. Our 'pen won the game and Eaton made his efforts obvious, so maybe it worked out after all?

I know - didn't say he wasn't.

Has Seanez really been a problem, for what his role is, before yesterday?

Something is definitely up. My guess is that Myers will go to the 'pen and that Happ will take Myers' spot in the rotation. Or there is a deal in the works involving Myers and other players (maybe to Toronto for Burnett and a LH reliever).

If they are going to trade away Happ, they better get something good. He looked decent in his short stay here. I'd rather see him get a shot at a rotation spot, but at who's expense? Myers will get at least 3 more turns I would think, and I don't think they view Happ as a bullpen guy.

Adam Eaton--worst Phillies free agent signing ever? Worst free agent signing for *any* team ever? Has anyone been this dreadful for $24 million?

The exciting, bullpen-strengthening shakeup would be to outright release Eaton and Seanez, call up Happ and trade for another competent reliever. What the Phillies will do is send Seanez to the minors/release him, keep Eaton and call up Happ.

To J. Weitzel: I didn't mean to imply that you did...sorry if you took it the wrong way as that was not my intention.

On Eaton...He is definitely the worst FA signing in Phillies history...though Danny Tartabull is up there as well.

Phils won't eat $10M by DFAing Eaton. Not gonna happen. They'll try to talk him into a minor league stint. They are killing the team by not recalling Happ.

Seanez is what he is, a spot righty who is good for blowouts and when better relievers are tired. Guys like him and Condrey are easily replaceable. But you don't cut him unless you have someone better to take his place.

Carl Pavano was an awful signing, as well, but for the Phils specifically, Eaton gets my vote.

Barry Zito doesn't look a great FA signing right now!

Clout: Do you think you're selling Condrey a little short? He's been fine, and he wouldn't be easily replaceable if you wanted to do it in-house. LV has nobody worth a damn but Happ.

Eaton is such a lost cause, he should not get another chance on this team. He is a better hitter that a pitcher. He should accept a minor league job and learn to play left field. I would love to see Happ and Vic stay but I feel they will be dealt.

Seanez Splits:

Pre AS: 2.40 ERA
Post AS: 13.50 ERA

Totals: 3.09 ERA, 23 K, 21 BB in 32 IP

The only thing that really concerns me is that walk rate...that's way too high for a reliever.

Personally, I think the trade for Garcia was a far worse disaster than Eaton signing. Eaton did win 10 games last year. Tartabull, as I recall, had onee AB. In terms of trades and personnel moves I can think of 4 or 5 worse ones during the Gillick era.

They could definitely sell high on Vic right now, but they'd also be trading away their starting CF and hottest hitter. Vic has been a real spark plug lately, and on a related note, Coste also came up strong these last two games.

Right, davthom? Paging davthom.

Garcia hurt more than Eaton in that we gave up 2 good pitchers for him and Floyd is all of a sudden looking like a #2 starter...his curve is wicked. I've watched a few games he's pitched this year and he is simply unhittable at times with that curve.

If we traded Vic I'd stop following the team. Just the thought makes me ill.

Jason: I see Condrey the same as Seanez. They are the 10th and 11th men on a staff and there are any number of AAA pitchers who could replace them (though none in the Phils system). But you don't cut them unless you have someone better coming in (i.e. to recall Happ if the Phils insist on keeping Eaton.)

by trying to send eaton to the minors we cover our asses financially, if he doesn't except, which has said he probably wouldn't, we are off the hook for the remainder of his salary

I think i was at the game for the Tartabull AB. One of the most exciting moments I've experienced as a phan.

Jason: davthom's negative Coste blog comment BlackBerry alert would not be activated by a positive post.

Didn't Tartabull hang himself in the clubhouse afterwards?

I don't see them making a single serious move from this point out. I'd love to see them acquire a guy like Mahay or Affeldt, but I think even that's too much to ask.

Clout: I worry more about Seanez being able to hold up through September. He was reportedly hurt a little while ago, and was hurt in ST. He was a good, veteran pickup, though. Similar signing as El Pulpo.

Tony: "if he doesn't except, which has said he probably wouldn't, we are off the hook for the remainder of his salary."

I don't think that's correct.

Actually we'd still be on the hook even if he didn't accept the assignment...any team picking him up would get him at the Veteran minimum though.

A trade thought: How about Emil Brown? He's said to be available, is righthanded and hits lefties well (.277 avg) and is supposedly available for next to nothing.

NEPHan: "Actually we'd still be on the hook even if he didn't accept the assignment...any team picking him up would get him at the Veteran minimum though."

This is my understanding also.

The Braves are cooked. The Phils finally broke them.

They will sell sell sell.

I am more forgiving than most as far as giving someone extra chances to prove themselves. In that light, Eaton is done done done...I don't care if they're paying him 100 million bucks in cash under the table. He needs to go. I can't help but wonder what the players on the field are muttering under their breath when he's pitching.

clout: This is my understanding also.

Yup...for reference See Richie Sexson...the Yanks are paying him a prorated vet. minimum for this season and the Mariners are on the hook for the remainder of his salary.

I for one am excited about the possibility of replacing Eaton with Happ. Or even replacing Eaton with nobody. Just not having Eaton on the team will be very exciting.

timr: I'm excited for the day we replace Eaton as well, but as clout said, it probably won't be today. You'll have to wait until TBA 2009 for the celebration.

One new rumor has the Phils and Mets both in "hot pursuit" of Manny Ramirez. The question: Would you include Marson in a trade for Manny, if it meant keeping Manny away from the Mets. In other words.. option 1 is trading Marson and getting Manny. Option 2 is not trading Marson and Manny goes to the Mets.

GoPhils- They are saying "wow, I think that ball is going to land in Ashburn Alley."

"My guess is that Myers will go to the 'pen and that Happ will take Myers' spot in the rotation."

Mr. Patrone, I don't think this will happen, but with the "oxymoron" running the show, anything can happen. I though about this last night, but what Myers really wants to do is close, and he found out (and was probably deeply dissapointed) about three weeks ago that closing for the Phillies is no longer an option (Lidge extension.)

I think it's more likely, assuming they don't trade Happ, that Myers gets at least 3 more starts to try to right the ship, and Happ is the long-man'situational lefty. If Myers can't "get right", they'll reverse Myers' and Happ's roles. That's my 2 cents.
___________________________________________

"But you don't cut him unless you have someone better to take his place."

clout, exactly!


"Personally, I think the trade for Garcia was a far worse disaster than Eaton signing."

And we would have Gavin Floyd in the rotation instead of Eaton or Blanton. For that matter, the Blanton trade would have been unnecessary, and the rotation (exept for Cole as the # 1, the rest are in no particular order) might look like this:

Hamels
Moyer
Myers
Floyd
Kendrick

with Happ ready to step in for spot starts, and Eaton the most expensive 7th man out of any 'pen.

Also, we'd still have "some dudes" in the minors to do another deal.

Option 3: Start puking at the thought of either Options 1 and 2. The Mets are only involved to drive up the price for us and vice versa. Marson should be off the table for Manny...they're welcome to Jaramillo though.

I think the way the Phillies handle the Eaton situation will show us a lot about their commitment to winning. Eaton does not belong on a play-off calibre team (any team really) at this time of the season. So if they are commited to winning Eaton must be cut. If all they care about is the business then somehow he stays

@ BobbyD

Option 3 is to not trade for him, and Mets not get him either. He'll be discussed, but at the end of the day, the Sox can't afford to trade him right now. Odds are they wouldn't get anyone back that could help now.

Omar loved him in the past, but he refuses to deal a top prospect for 2 months of Manny. And rightfully so.

MFiP: I understand. I'm just saying if you HAD to pick one of those unhappy choices...

On Floyd: I have a friend who pitched for Cornell (and I'm not sure how that helped him garner this information, although I remember that it did in some way), and he swore by this story: Ken Williams heard from someone in his organization that Floyd had been tipping his pitches throughout his time up in Philadelphia, so he made it a point to seek him out in any deal with the Phils. When they got him, he shared this information with him, and after a little more seasoning, he's the Gavin Floyd we see today. Not sure if that's actually true or not, but it's interesting because I remember that his stuff never seemed to be questioned. It was just what he did it with it.

Ah gotcha.

Well if my choices were Manny to the Mets for F-Mart (which would be the equivelent of asking for Carrasco), or Manny to the Phills, I think I take option 2.

No offense, but seeing an OF that had both PtB and Manny in it would be scary.

I don't know how Manny fits in here. He can't play RF. They'd never spend the money to re-sign him. With the Mets new stadium coming on line next season, the Phillies will have to get used to major star signings by the Mets that they can't or won't compete with. That's why the window of opportunity for this team is closing.

NEPP & BobbyO, the Phillies have already denied any interest in Ramirez.

Besides, where woud Ramirez play? He might be a worse fielder than Burrell.

For them to do the deal, Burrell would almost have to be included in return, as the Red Sox would have to replace Manny's production somehow(unless it was a three-way deal and they moved Manny somewhere else?), and I don't think Burrell, at this stage would agree to a trade.

Remember, Pat Burrell has a FULL NO-TRADE CLAUSE.

(Although he might waive it to go to the Red Sox if they gave him a huge extension as part of the deal).

Eaton's salary seems to be a sunk cost. If its something the Phillies have to pay whether they keep Eaton or not, then would it not make sense to simply sever ties here and now? What's the point of having Eaton "earn" his money if in the process of "earning" it he costs us games?

"That's why the window of opportunity for this team is closing."

Yep!

The Red Sox are a team that PtB is willing to go to.

"What's the point of having Eaton "earn" his money if in the process of "earning" it he costs us games?"

Klaus, that's a question for the "oxymoron" to answer, errr, I mean the "Phillies braintrust".

Klaus: if they keep Eaton around, they can pretend he might earn his remaining $10 million. To get rid of it him is to admit that it was a total mistake, and that's very un-Phillies-like.

Eaton agrees to go to the minors. Will someone else post this before I hit "Post"? Let's see...

Just in from the Zo Zone: Eaton optioned to minors...

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/phillies_zone/

As Juan Samuel used to say in the ad from the 80's, "I am the fastest".

He won't be missed.

Correction: He will be missed by the rest of the league.

Yay Eaton! You done good. Stand up guy, that Eaton. Awful pitcher, but a good guy.

Remember, right after they DL'd Eaton last year didn't they start their surge?

Hopefully, the same thing happens this season.

They probably convinced Eaton to take some time off, build up some arm strength, work or relieving, and that he'll be recalled once rosters expand in September.

Ding, dong, the witch is dead.

I'm not sure it was the back-to-back jacks that did Eaton in... I think it was the shot he gave up to the pitcher in the next at bat.

Put me in the "dump Seanez" camp, too. He needs to be replaced. He's out of gas. The numbers show it. He can't be trusted to get outs at this point. Condrey is our blowout guy... we don't need two of them.

I am glad Happ is finally back with the big league team, but I hope that they don't move him to the bullpen. He's still better than Adam Eaton, But Happ is used to being a starter and should stay in that role. Send Myers to the pen instead.

In 2008 and the future,
Pat Burrell >>>>> Manny Ramirez

The Red Sox had better offer much, much more than just Manny Ramirez if they want Pat Burrell. Burrell is better offensively and defensively, 5 years younger, makes 1/2 as much and isn't annoying...plus he's Irish, which probably counts for something in Boston.

Sure the Red Sox could use a disciplined right-handed power hitter like Pat Burrell, but so could the Phillies. I could see the Phillies renting Ramirez for the rest of the year, but trading Burrell for Ramirez wouldn't made any sense.

Baxter: couldn't agree more. Would much rather have Burrell over Ramirez right now.

Since we're stuck paying him no matter what, It's good to see him accept the assignment and hopefully work out his mechanics so he can help us out this year.

So our opening day starter and another starter making $8 million have both been sent to the minors this year. Last year's MVP has been benched twice. The previous MVP was at the Mendoza line until about a month ago. The man who was predicted to win this year's MVP has done nothing since May. And yet we are only 1 game out of first place. I guess it could be worse. Thank God for the bullpen.

I can't believe I would ever utter those words with this team.

Give some credit to Gillick. How many GMs this year have sent 2 of the team's 5 starting pitchers to the minor leagues? That's a lot of money and egos he's dealt with but he did so to make the team better.

The jury is out on whether sending Myers to the MLs worked ... he sure struggled when he returned. I'm going to tomorrow's game against the Nationals ... and if he gives up more than 2 runs against THAT AAA team, we'll know he won't be able to help the Phillies in 2008.

The Phillies ought to sweep the gawd-awful Nats.

>>No offense, but seeing an OF that had both PtB and Manny in it would be scary.<<

Yeah, defensively-REALLY scary...maybe we can play four outfielders, then.

1. Garcia trade was worth it. We paid 10 million for one win. We wont the division by 1 game. Therefor, Garcia's one win can be credited for the Phills making the playoffs... haha...

2. I wish Happ could be thrown into the rotation, but I honestly think Myers can (and possibly has) turn a corner and become a above average pitcher again... but maybe thats just wishful thinking.

Cipper: Yes that would be wishful thinking...though I will say he didn't allow a HR last time out which is rare for him.

How long can Eaton be sent down for? I recall Myers limit was something like 20 days because of pension rights?

"The Phillies ought to sweep the gawd-awful Nats."

BEWARE!!!!!

BeerLeaguer Reverse Jinx Alert!!!!!

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