Game chat: Phillies-killer Redding, Moyer clash in D.C.

The Phillies have not scored a run in two games against tonight's starter Tim Redding this season. The Nationals’ ace is 4-2 with a 2.34 ERA in eight career starts against them. Jamie Moyer, who’s been nearly as tough on Washington, goes for the Phils. First pitch is 7:10 ET.   

Rumor roundup: It’s safe to assume the Phillies are working the phones as tomorrow’s non-waiver trade deadline approaches. Around the Web, the latest reports view Manny Ramirez as a longshot. Yesterday, Jayson Stark floated a trade scenario involving Kansas City reliever Ron Mahay, but no new information has surfaced since this morning. Meanwhile on MLBtraderumors.com, Tim Dierkes picked up on a report from ESPN radio involving Jayson Werth. The Rays plan on scouting the Phillies’ outfielder. A scout for the Rays, who are in heavy talks about "Correct Spelling of Jason" Bay, believes Werth could be had in the right deal. One would assume the Phillies' acquisition of an even bigger right-handed bat would be a prelude for any deal involving Werth.

Comments

[Bedrosian's Beard]

I'll be representing in Sec 126 behind home plate.

[doubleh]

Enough of this trade deadline BS! I, for one, can't wait until it passes. I'm sick of hearing about all the non-moves we're going to make.

[MG]

Deja vu - Phils were 56-49 this date last year and in 2nd place exactly 3 games behind the Mets. This year 57-49 and a .5 half game out. Plus they are relatively healthy too.

Crazy how things can look better depending upon the comparison?

[sdphillie]

Tim Kirkjan is reporting something in the works involving the Phillies and the Arizona Diamondbacks, reportedly for Rico Brogna.

I'll keep you all updated.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

Kyle Drabek returned today:
3IP, 1H, 0K, 0BB, GB/FB 9/0

[Bubba]

Hope we have "deja vu all aver again" at the last day of the season.

[MG]

Given Gillick's penance for former player and the crazy rumors for Rhodes, I wonder if Gillick will made a trade for Willie Bloomquist to give the Phils a "quality veternan off the bench." Too bad Bret Boone and David Bell aren't available.

[bay_area_phan]

Per mlbtr: "On the Phillies' radar: John Grabow, Will Ohman, Arthur Rhodes, and Jack Taschner. "

Ah, yes. That's the Phillies we know and love. With barely 24 hours left until the non-waivers trading deadline, the valid rumors are starting to separate themselves from the bogus ones. Out with the discussion about Manny Ramirez, Brian Fuentes, Ron Mahay, and A.J. Burnett. In with the rumors about Jack Taschner, John Grabow, and Arthur Rhodes. Jason said it yesterday, and it echoed the very thoughts I was having: Jack Taschner just screams Phillie. By this time tomorrow, Taschner will be a Phillie and Jason Donald will be in the Giants' system.

[EastFallowfield]

Redding was the losing pitcher in last year's clincher.

They need to look at the tapes from that game (maybe inspire the team to try to get back to that kind of feeling again).

[mvptommyd]

As an interesting sidenote, we need to go 43-13 to meet J STRoll's 100 win prediction

[MG]

I give Taschner credit for accepting the advice that Righetti came his this spring training. Turned him into a credible reliever but he wouldn't be much of an upgrade either.
The kind of player you hope the Phils would acquire after the deadline for a lesser prospect.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

"The kind of player you hope the Phils would acquire after the deadline for a lesser prospect."

That's pretty much what Stark said on 950Am today: Probably after the deadline and a 3rd tier reliever.

[MG]

BAP - Bloomquist is exactly the type of player I expect the Phils to acquire after the trading deadline especially if Feliz's back is more of an issue than the Phils are letting on. A "veteran off the bench who can play at 3B or even the OF."

[timr]

43-13? With Manny and Roy Halladay on the team now, this will be no problem.

[Bubba]

Hey mvp-
If we go a lot deeper into the playoffs I'd be glad to count those wins towards JR's 100 win prediction.

[bay_area_phan]

MG: Au contraire. David Bell and Brett Boone are very much available. And no Phillies season is ever complete without Gillick bringing in a couple of guys who have been out of the majors for at least 2 years (i.e., LaForest, R. Simon, J.D. Durbin), or who played on his old Mariner teams (i.e., Jamie Moyer, Ryan Franklin, Jose Mesa, Freddy Garcia, Arthur Rhodes). Bell and Boone meet both these criteria. It's a near certainty that one of them will be a Phillie before the season is over.

[mvptommyd]

It was a joke. We are going to win the same as last year 89.

[MG]

Interesting point about the 100 win. Since I bet the Phils win the division again outright with 89 wins, they need to go 32-24 or play at a .570 clip the rest of the way.

Possible yeah but going to need Blanton and Myers to both contribute and have one of the big 3 get hot on offensive (JRoll, Howard, or Utley) to carry the team for a bit.

[Frankie Four Fingers]

Trade Werth, Moyer, and Condrey for Manny, Lester, and Delcarmen?

[Bedrosian's Beard]

MG/BAP-you guys are sounded way to alike right now to be two different people.

[MG]

Top vegetarian ballpark in baseball - take that Mets!

Seriously BAP, I fully except the Phils to acquire some veteran scrub since Feliz is probably going to be out to the third week of August (15-day DL and probably a few rehab games to get his timing back).

[donc]

I hear Don Money is available. The price would be right too.

[MG]

Weitzel should hold a contest - guess the former player that Gillick acquires for the stretch run. Tie break is the first date in which he actually appears in a game.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

The good news is the Marlins may be close to landing Rhodes.

[mvptommyd]

Yea, I think we have to give Blanton 2 more Starts before we start to really judge his performance. His next 2 starts are @ Cardinals and home against Pittsburgh i believe, so a sinking team and an awful team. I would Say they are 2 good barometers. With all the hitters we have 1-7 minus Ruiz or Feliz given the day in the 8th hole I like our lineup overall without being greedy. And our closer is better this year so far than last and if Myers Struggles we have Happ right there for them to switch roles, the only thing I am worried about is Moyer holding up and our relief pitching.

We are on Pace to win 93 right now, but I think we will end up with 89.

[George]

Buster Olney reporting that the Mets might make a run at Jarrod Washburn given the John Maine might be on the shelf for the rest of the season. If the Mets get Washburn instead of the Phils, I'd be bummed. Thoughts here?

[donc]

mvp: Agree we can't bail on Blanton yet. It is too early. It would be easier to have patience if he didn't look so damn Eatonesque though.

[George]

Whoa ... Just read what Washburn makes. Maybe I won't be bummed.

[Chasethebat]

I see it as a complete disaster if the phillies dont make a run at a big name such as manny or a top notch starter. The phillies keep in mind may not make the playoffs this year. Nothing is garunteed. In the short window that we have here with utley howard rolline hamels lidge etc, we cannot afford to be missing the playoffs. These guys need to get into the playoffs each of the next 3 years or its over for the phillies for a long time. This is our window lets not blow it like the eagles sixers and flyers did. Not getting a big name is a complete disaster for this ball club and fans, thoughts?

[NEPhilliesPhan]

So George I'm confused...you'd actually want Jarrod Washburn?!? He's having an absolutely horrible year...even worse than Blanton's and he's owed a ton of money.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

George you have a quote on that Maine out for season rumor?

[donc]

mvp: Agree we can't bail on Blanton yet. It is too early. It would be easier to have patience if he didn't look so damn Eatonesque though.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

Hasn't Washburn been doing well in his last 4-5 starts?

[mvptommyd]

George: Don't be worried, the Mets aren't getting anyone. They put their only trade worthy prospects as untouchable and now that they are desperate is only going to drive the asking price up. Plus what current roster players of theirs would you want???

DonC: I see your point, but look at his 2 games. @ Shea right off the bat in a HUGE game. So big I can't even type HUGE big enough and then in the Hurricane Sunday and even then only let up 2 runs. Have some Faith my man. Wait until he gives up 6 then we can start to complain.

[Poster Nutbag]

i don't know what would make me more depressed than seeing arthur rhodes in a phillies uniform again.

[Steve Jeltz]

Nutbag:

Maybe seeing Jose Mesa in a Phillies uniform again.

[George]

NEPP, Nope - I kind of spoke out of turn (or out of something else). I don't know Washburn that well, I just hate the idea of the Mets making a deal to bring on a weapon in the arms race when we need a strong arm ourselves.

[BobbyD]

I was just thinking how pathetic it would be if the Phils let the Mets win the division. Think about the Mets: Chavez in RF, Tatis/Andersen in LF, that bullpen, Maine's problems. I mean seriously. If the Phillies don't win the division it's their own damn fault. They're like Arizona-lite right now. Phils and D-Backs should both be 10 games up.

[Brian G]

EF: Bergmann was the loser in last year's clincher, which was the final game of the season.

[Brian]

George, I think if the Mets get washburn its a good thing he's not worth a rosenbag. If they get him its almost a garaunteed loss for the Mets every 5th day and plus one less prospect or two in their system. So please by all means mr. minaya acquire washburn.

[donc]

I don't know if I'm alone in feeling like this, but if it's not Hamels or Lidge and to a lesser extent Moyer on the mound, I have feelings of dread. I don't know if fans of other teams feel like that or not. Other than those three I just have no confidence. And we just keep bringing in mediocrity. It never changes.
I guess I should include Durbin. He's been very reliable. Otherwise I just reach for the bottle.

[Brian G]

I don't understand the disappointment with the Phillies not making a move. If there's no move to make, then that's the way it is. It's always more exciting, but generally a bad idea to force something because of an arbitrary deadline in the middle of the season.
However, if the Marson/Donald/Happ/Castro for Holliday rumor is true(which I'm 99% sure it's not), and they don't do it, then the Phillies FO should be tarred and feathered.

[bay_area_phan]

BB: And we both live in the Bay Area too. Highly suspicious, no?

I'll take a shot at MG's lottery. My guess for the ex-Mariner that lands with the Phillies is John Halama, who is currently pitching for the Indians' Triple A team. He'll be acquired, most likely after 7-31, in order to provide "organizational depth." He'll get called up in August and pitch for the first time on August 21.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

Halladay, not Holliday. I have to think "Castro" is actually "Carrasco".

[Alex]

SI's Jon Heyman is on WFAN in NY right now and he speculated for Manny the Phils would have to give up Burrell and Marson. So far he says they have shown no interest in giving up much for Manny and with that suggested package I think you can see why.

[EastFallowfield]

OK, we beat Redding in our next to last win in 2007. That was a good one too.

[mvptommyd]

I am flipping between 610 and 950. And it seems whenever I turn on 610 between 3-7 for that joke Eskin, he is trying to boost his sinking ratings by making up a fake rumor. Two nights ago it was the Holliday and Zaun trade rumor and today it's that Hamels has a frature in his pitching elbow and scouts are surprised he can still pitch the way he does. Eskin needs to get a life and stop bragging about his sources and get reliable ones.

[NEPhilliesPhan]

Why the hell would they even consider that deal? Burrell alone is having a better year than Manny.

[EastFallowfield]

How good are the Nats?

The Nationals are 5-17 in July, yet have only been outscored 88-84. The Pythagorean Formula predicts they should be 10-12. They lost 13 games by two runs or less.

[doubleh]

Alex: That's downright thievery. No way we should give up Marson AND Burrell for Manny Ramirez. Burrell arguably has better stats and has more game winning hits than Manny this season and he's younger. I can't believe the Sox' arrogance. I realize Manny is a HOFer, but come on, really.

[Brian G]

BB: Yeah, Halladay, I'm an idiot. I wouldn't do that package for Holliday.

If we trade Burrell for Manny I'm going to be be seriously unhappy unless we get Clay Buckholz back with him. The guy signed a $160 mil contract and is now dogging it bc he is unhappy that the contract contains two options FOR 20 MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR!

[THe Dude]

little birdy told me that its widely known around scouts that Cole has a small fracture in his pitching elbow...anyone worried yet?

[king myno]

As cool as it might be to have Manny's bat, it's nowhere near worth Burrell and Marson (even in the fantasy world where Phillies management makes big moves).

[doubleh]

myp: Eskin also said the other day when I was driving home that Utley may need surgery.

I don't trust Eskin when it comes to Phillies info, because he's no insider there. He's a lackey for the Eagles and hates the Phils because they don't give him unlimited access to the players, rumors, clubhouse, etc.

[mvptommyd]

Just because Eskin said it......No not worried

[BobbyD]

Phils vs. Mets is pretty close actually

1B Howard / Delgado PHI
2B Utley / Easley PHI
SS Rollins / Reyes NY (this year)
3B Wright / Feliz NY
LF Burrell / Tatis PHI
CF Victorino / Beltran NY
RF Werth,Jenkins / Chavez PHI
C Ruiz, Coste / Castro, Schneider NY

SP Hamels / Santana
SP Moyer / Maine
SP Blanton / Perez NY
SP Myers / Pelfrey
SP Kendrick / Martinez

RP Seanez / Feliciano
RP Durbin / Heilman
RP Madsen / Smith
RP Romero / Sanchez PHI
RP Condrey / Schoeneweis
CP Lidge / Wagner

[Bedrosian's Beard]

He's so anti Phillie I don't believe a word of it.

[doubleh]

Eskin's also probably got ratings to worry about now that he has to compete for the first time in forever with Missanelli on 950 at the same time.

[mvptommyd]

DoubleH: Yea I agree, He is like Dave Spadaro Part II. I much rather listen to Missaneli up the dial but I listen to Eskin during mikey's breaks.

[Alex]

Heyman is off his rocker regarding Manny and the Phils. Don't think it has any shot of happening, but according to him it's between the Phils, Marlins, and Dodgers.

[MG]

Washburn is toast at this point and I would love for the Mets to be stuck with his entire salary next year. Wonder if Maine is hurt worse if they are letting on? I know Mets fans will wax about how Pelfrey has turned in a dominant starter (excellent run support and the peripheral suggest otherwise) and how Perez has been untoachable (again if you take out his domination of the Phils no so hot).

Is a Mets' rotation of Santana, Perez, Pelfrey, Pedro, and Washburn? better than the Phils' rotation of Hamels, Moyer, Kendrick, Blanton, and Myers? I don't think so. Both suspect after their ace.

[doubleh]

Besides, how many ballplayers/athletes play with worse injuries and we never know about it until after the season is over, if ever? I would guess quite a few, especially those playing for a contract.

I mean, look at that guy on the Red Wings: he played with blood on his BRAIN.

[Deutsche Phan]

BobbyD: Assuming for a second that this is a worthwhile endeavor, the most laugh-out-loud washes included are Durbin/ Heilman and Lidge/ Wagner

[Vonderful]

Reporting Pudge to the Yankees on ESPN.

[MG]

I still wonder if the cheapskate Marlins' owners make a move. Figure their rotation will be as least competitive as the Mets/Phils with the return of Johnson and Sanchez. Desperately need a C though and another legit setup arm. If Fish got both, I would like them to win the East then.

[bay_area_phan]

The Yankees wasted little time filling the hole left by Posada's injury. They just traded for Pudge Rodriguez.

[CJ]

The Yankees dealt for Pudge Rodriguez? Am I late in catching up on that?

[Vonderful]

They traded Pudge for Farnsworth

[doubleh]

MG: According to Mets fans, Pelfrey > Hamels. They seriously think this...someone the other day said Hamels would be the #4 starter on the Mets. Do they only look at wins? Do that not know that ERA is not park adjusted? I mean, Jamie Moyer and Johann Santana have the same number of wins--Moyer must be better than Johan! Gimme a break.

[Vonderful]

Mets fans are delusional. They all secretly want to be Yankee fans.

[mvptommyd]

DoubleH: Don't worry if Pelfrey gets racked tonight they will change their tune after the game. I hear it's kind of Fair weather up there today

[Alex]

Pudge is nothing, but a decent average hitter anymore.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

I think the Yanks are happy to have a "decent average hitter". In fact, I wish we had one.

[Vonderful]

Pudge would look great in our lineup and in our clubhouse.

[Alex]

He would be great for us if he brought his PEDs.

[baxter]

I don't really look in the clubhouse much.

[CJ]

Jessica Alba would look great in our clubhouse.

[Dan]

exactly right re: Eskin and ratings...i was listening late night on 610 and they have these awful promos about Eskin and "the breaking Philly sports news" he provides...ughh get over yourself, jackass

i agree with most in thinking the phils will land a serviceable lefty relieve and maybe a value village pickup in a few weeks

[doubleh]

CJ: If you think we have clubhouse distractions now, Jessica Alba would absolutely obliterate it.

[Poster Nutbag]

the pudge deal is less about the players involved and more about a team showing how to get things done and filling a hole they need to make a playoff run. with posada out, the yanks needed a catcher. and they got pudge. and they gave up nothing (all of my yankee fan friends hate farnsworth). the phillies need a starter? trade werth (as much as i like the guy) if you must. hell, trade burrell. he has to look attractive to a team who could use a) hitting and b) an expiring contract. i say no one should be "untouchable" if it makes your team better. granted, you aren't likely to find a trade involving utley that makes the team better, so he is de facto untouchable, but still...do something.

making B-list moves at the deadline IS NOT A WAY TO WIN A WORLD SERIES.

[CJ]

doubleh: Perhaps... but she'd still look great there.

I just hate the idea of a "clubhouse guy." Either you can play baseball or you can't. Pudge will likley do better than the replacement the Yanks had for Posado, but it won't matter one bit what kind of a "clubhouse guy" he is.

[mvptommyd]

Getting back to Eskin: He didn't even first report the signing of Kareem Rush, Gargano and Mcnow did before they got off the air then he came on and said he found it out. No wonder no one likes him, he is a leach off other hosts.

[CJ]

Poster Nutbag: Thanks for your enlightening input. I hesitate to pull this out...

PAT BURRELL HAS A NO TRADE CLAUSE

Okay, I said it.

[doubleh]

CJ: I agree with your analysis of clubhouse guys. I think winning makes clubhouses great and losing makes for clubhouse "cancers".

My point on Alba is that they'd all be staring at her and likely wouldn't get much done in terms of preparation. But I'm certain they'd have fun.

[Bedrosian's Beard]

I know "clubhouse guy" gets used to often and is likely overrated, but to discount it totally is a bit much, especially with all the "Manny is such a cancer!!!" talk (not that you ,CJ, were specifically saying that about Manny).

[Poster Nutbag]

thanks for the correction CJ, but you get my point.

[doubleh]

mvp: There are so many reasons to dislike Eskin, how can you pick just one?

[Andy]

Thanks, CJ. I thought I'd have to get serious with the HTML tags.

[Andy]

hh -
In re: reasons to dislike Eskin
I pick: "his mother dresses him funny."

[Slocs]

jimmy might start arriving early if Jessica is there

[doubleh]

Andy: I pick "What are you cooking for dinner tonight?" to any female caller. (as a female, I find this insulting, sue me)

[CJ]

Bed Beard: Yes... I agree wholeheartedly that there can be players who are detrimental to a clubhouse environment. I tend, however, to discount the suggestion that some guys somehow boost a clubhouse environment. As doubleh says, winning is the best way to create chemistry.

[AWH the RBP]

hh, what ARE you cooking for dinner?

Would you be willing to host the first annual BerrLeaguer BBQ?

[doubleh]

AWH: Only if I can have it fully catered.

I am most likely ordering takeout as I normally do. I work for a living and have a toddler, no time to cook.

[Jack]

In DC and about to leave for the game- is anyone else concerned about the weather?

[AWH the RBP]

Re: Burrell and Marson for Manny.

This is probably what Epstein floated to the Phillies, and the rumor source is the RSox organization.

IMO, the Phillies would be sheer IDIOCY to agree to that. In fact, they'd be insane to trade Burrell, who by all accounts gets along with his teammates, for a guy who is all about himself. Throwing in Marson would qualify them for the assylum.

The reason there is such interest in Marson is elementary:

Look at the catching situation in MLB. There is very little depth in most organizations, and Marson is potential #1.

Now, I know little about evaluating prospects (except that I know a good one when I see him play), but from what I've read on BL, Marson is close to being MLB ready. Boston has an aging Varitek, and Marson could be groomed to replace him.

At this stage I view Burrell/M Ramirez as a lateral move production wise, so why bother making the trade?

Throwing in Marson would be about the dumbest move the "oxymoron" has ever made, and as we all know, they've made some incredibly bad and stupid trades.

In fact, if Epstein called me (and, of course, I was Pat Gillick), I would ask him who he was throwing in with Ramirez for Burrell, as I was taking a big pain in the ass off of his hands. I would also tell him I was going to exercize Manny's options, and that I expected him to throw in a few million to help cover the cost.

Adding Manny Ramirez to the Phillies would be subtraction by addition.

[UD Hens]

Jack - bring your raincoat, chance of thunderstorms tonight in DC and in the DelVal too.

[Vonderful]

With the clubhouse thing I meant that maybe he would inject a little emotion into a team that seems to lack it on occasion.

[NEPhilliesPhan]

So a thought on the Pudge trade...though he had a horrible start to the season he's batting .346 since June 1 and .295 overall...I think the Yanks just robbed the Tigers much like they robbed the Pirates last week.

[bay_area_phan]

Can Jessica Alba hit left-handed pitching?