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Wednesday, November 21, 2007

Comments

Most likely to make and most likely to cause collective high blood pressure with the Beerleaguer faithful (assuming its at the expense of NOT pursuing Kuroda).

Kris/Anna Benson would be a nightmare and Mike Wood would become more interesting for the PG-13 caliber nickname potential than anything. Clement is an interesting name, but more may be more likely to put up an Eaton-esque season.

Nice buzzkill before I head out for the T-giving holiday.

Oh, and I submit "morning" as my recommendation for a Mike Wood nickname.

He chose to take a one year deal in Las Angelas as opposed to signing a multi - year deal with Phil. the last time he was a free agent. What makes you think that he is going to want to come back?

I think Kuroda would be a great fit in Philly, or more accurately in CBP. He played all ten years in Japan in a park with only 300 feet to left and right and put up great numbers. CBP would feel like Petco to him.

"What makes you think that he is going to want to come back?"

Because there's not going to be a lot of demand for his services. He went home, now the Dodgers don't want him anymore. And he'll come cheap. That's why the Phillies would want him, and why he'd come back.

Pops, the Phils may be after him because he declined the Phillies offer to play for his hometown team, the Dodgers, who no longer want him... he didn't leave on bad terms. in fact, quite the opposite. he really liked it here, but just wanted a chance to put on the Dodger blue.

Wolf would want to come back because LA doesn't want him this time around. According to Wolf himself, his decision to leave the Phillies was at the time a very difficult one.

Everyone loves Wolfie, and sentimentally it'd be great to see him return. Objectively, however, this is an injury-riddled, fly-ball pitcher. But if this is the lower-tier pitcher they have in mind while they shell out the bigger bucks for Rowand, I'll take it.

responding to the last thread: I have zero interest in Podsednik. his speed's gotten steadily worse (judging by SB & SB%), he's got Nunez-level power, and he can't play anywhere other than left. the 2008 Phillies have no need for him.

I'm agree with Slugdog 100%. Unless a pitcher has superb talent/stuff (i.e. Hamels), the Phils need to go after pitchers like Kuroda - groundball pitchers that are going to let the defense make outs for them and not give up big home runs (Kendrick is a great example of this). With our ballpark, this is the only reliable way to build a pitching staff. If the choice is between Wolf and Kuroda, as much as I/everyone liked Wolfie, I think you have to choose Kuroda.

Wolf still wants to remain on the West Coast. I read that somewhere within the last week. Obviously, if no West Coast team makes him an offer then the Phillies have a good shot.

Re: J.D. Durbin on the last thread. Are we talking about the same Durbin who pitched for the Phillies last season? Who finished the season 6-5 with a 6.06 ERA, a 1.76 WHIP and a K/BB ratio of 37/40?

Which teams out West would be a fit for Wolf? Not LA or LAA. Probably not SF. Maybe Oakland? Seattle?

No on Randy Wolf. Flyball pitcher who adds a nice sentimental feeling and seems like a good guy, but speaking of "upside" I see none with him.

GET KURODA!

Question on Wolf. Is there any "upside" with respect to his Tommy John surgery; i.e., his arm continuing to improve over the next year, or has any mid/long term improvement that would normally be expected after that operation already taken place (if it's going to happen at all)?

I always liked him, he seemed like a gamer and team guy, and I was sorry to see him go in that regard. But not sure if he is more than a lower tier acquisition, as per RSB.

Another gem of an article by Dayn Perry over at foxsports. He has the following to say about Rollins:

With that being said, Rollins was not the guy. Not even close. Rollins is a smart, hard-working ballplayer and a good leader, and he's got baseball skills for days. However, he's not the MVP. He didn't deserve to win the Gold Glove at short (is it too much to ask that we make this award about, you know, actual defensive ability?), and his power numbers were aided greatly by his home park, which has been the best power environment in all of baseball throughout its brief existence. Rollins' OBP of .344 is also nothing special considering the context.

He then argues that David Wright deserved the MVP because of his, you guessed it, gold glove caliber defense (because a gold glove is earned when you play for Perry's NY Mets) and his "insanely clutch hitting" especially late in the season and against the Phillies. Perry basically takes stats out of context to make pathetic arguments. All I can say to Dayn Perry is following, THIS IS WHY YOU DON'T VOTE FOR THE MVP AND WHY YOU NEVER WILL!

Clement is from Butler, PA. We're still talking five hours away, but maybe that could help the Phillies if they're bidding against a west coast or southern team...
Probably no shot at Kuroda. He wants to stay closer to Japan:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/baseball/340426_mari21.html

I'm more concerned with the fraying in his shoulder than with the TJ stuff.

Pretty depressing list of pitchers. I now that Wolf gets the nod because he had some decent years here but he really hasn't healthy since 2004. The last thing the Phils need is to sign another pitcher likely to spend most of his season on the DL.

For the others, I really have no idea. Guess it depends on what kind of evaluation they get from the Phils' medical staff. Clement has never been the same pitcher since he got hit by the line drive in Boston in July 2005. Plus, he is coming off major surgery that had numerous setbacks in his rehab last year. Seems like a real reach.

Benson never lived up his hype but he was an effective pitcher before his TJ surgery. Almost more inclined to sign him to a 1-yr deal with a club option (could get healthy and be a nice surprise for 2009).

Guess I hope that the Phils take a gamble on Kuroda. No idea how he will handle the transition to MLB but seems right up Gillick's alley to take a gamble here (although he doesn't meet the perquisite that he has played for a former Gillick team).

Pretty depressing list of pitchers. I now that Wolf gets the nod because he had some decent years here but he really hasn't healthy since 2004. The last thing the Phils need is to sign another pitcher likely to spend most of his season on the DL.

For the others, I really have no idea. Guess it depends on what kind of evaluation they get from the Phils' medical staff. Clement has never been the same pitcher since he got hit by the line drive in Boston in July 2005. Plus, he is coming off major surgery that had numerous setbacks in his rehab last year. Seems like a real reach.

Benson never lived up his hype but he was an effective pitcher before his TJ surgery. Almost more inclined to sign him to a 1-yr deal with a club option (could get healthy and be a nice surprise for 2009).

Guess I hope that the Phils take a gamble on Kuroda. No idea how he will handle the transition to MLB but seems right up Gillick's alley to take a gamble here (although he doesn't meet the perquisite that he has played for a former Gillick team).

Conlin's article the other week talking about Golson, Carrasco, and Outman being spring training stories seems much more relevant now.

I don't think any of these guys are ready open the season with the Phils but it looks more and more likely that there is going to be an opportunity for a rookie to win a reserve OF position, a 5th starter job, and 1 or 2 bullpen spots.

I can only imagine the responses this will get, but I don't want Wolf back for one simple reason: he's not loyal.

He owed us something last year after financing his rehab and turned his back (no matter how difficult he says the decision was). That's not a player I want the Phillies to go after; it's totally shameless if they do.

Brett: "GET KURODA!"

Brett, if you can get him into the bargain bin at the Dollar store, I'll pick him up for you.

(Yeah, that was me.)

I would also not be surprised if Prior's not on their list, too, but not getting mentioned unless (as per MLBTR) he's officially non-tendered.

(Wait. That's backwards - I'd be surprised if he's not...etc)

clout -
Ruben Amaro Jr. is the perfect example of what you were saying - a guy who ate up minor league pitching but couldn't hit in the majors. Including his last couple years, whenh he had aweful stats both places, his minor league OPS was .832 (with 235 SB vs. 92 CS). In the majors, however, his lifetime average was .235 and his OPS was .663.

While Snelling could have the upside to be a Victorino, he also, just as easily, could turn out to be a Ruben Jr.

I'm all for signing Mark Prior after we get either Kuroda (ideally) or Wolf. But would Prior take a minor league deal? Would he compete for a rotation spot. If we already had Hamels, Myers, Kuroda/Wolf, Moyer, and Kendrick, where could we fit him? I think Prior is too big of an injury risk to leave him competing with Eaton for the 5th starter job with no other alternatives but I really would love to have him in the system just in case. Perhaps it's just wishful thinking though to hope to sign a starter and then Prior as well, but it would be a damn good idea if at all possible.

What about Kerry Wood as setup man?

Kuroda is my choice, along w/ using Lowell's $ for Rowand. Kurida seems to be the only guy w/o baggage. As for Snelling, can you say Karim Garcia? He'll get cut in spring training.

Eh, I think Snelling and Garcia are different animals. At least Snelling has some upside.

My fear with Wolf is that he never regularly pitched in CBP. A lefty flyball pitcher has some serious limitations when coupled with our left field wall and the prevailing winds.

Snelling has more upside than Garcia but that not exactly setting the bar very high. I just hope this isn't Gillick main effort at filling Bourn's spot to platoon with Werth/primary OF reserve.

We already have a soft tossing lefty.

On the other hand Wade brought us the very team we like today--Rollins, Utley, Burrel, Howard, Hamels etc etc.
I think the bigger problem is ownership. Here the Phillies are on the cusp of greatness and they won't spent the extra dollars to insure it. Its amazing that the example of the Red Sox has not penetrated Philly ownership. Frankly, we wouldn't even have to spend anywhere near as much as the Red Sox. But we have to wonder how many potnetial signings (Lowell, Schilling)were nipped at the bud simply becuase the players did not think that managmentn would execute.

A,b,c Armas,Benson ,Colon throw in Lieber,Jennings,Wolfe. Sign as many as you can to incentive laced contracts.One of them makes it you are ahead of the game.I think Jennings has lots of upside,Armas could be used in the pen.

I always enjoyed Jayson Stark. "Teams that have talked to the Pirates say they're in the midst of a monstrous internal debate about whether they'd be willing to at least dangle Snell, a major 26-year-old talent who had more quality starts this year (22) than Santana or Roy Oswalt and a better strikeout rate (7.66 per 9 innings) than Carlos Zambrano or Ben Sheets."

I'd love to see the Phils inquire about Snells. I'd personally rather see Bedard, but Snells is probably cheaper and more realistic.

Thoughts on Snell offer? Are there enough bullets in the arsenal to make it at all realistic?

On Snell, hmmmm...
I wonder what the Bucs would want. On the one hand, if I were them I'd hold onto a young talent with a clenched fist. OTOH they traded away talent for Morris.

Maybe they'd like Eaton and Helms. (j/k)

On a more serious note, I wonder if they'd do Snell for Golson.

If Golson is all it would take to get Snell I'd do it in a heartbeat. Hell, I'd even throw in Happ.

Keep going...gotta be more than Golson.

For Snell, my guess is that at worst it would take a three player package - i.e. a top prospect, likely from the pitching dept.; a mid-tier prospect; and a young/cheap MLB pitcher.

top prospects (1) - cardenas, carrasco, drabek, savery
mid-tier (1) - Happ, Golson, Jaramillo
MLB (1) - Madson

Back to reality . . . . here's a couple of interesting articles on defense (Phils ranked 2nd in NL last year in DER); Geoff Jenkins ranks high as both a defensive fielder (DER) and in arm strength.

http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/
cat_probabilistic_model_of_range.php

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/
cannons-and-popguns-rating-outfield-arms/

Alright phans, here's the scoop. Got a call form my source earlier tonight.

1. Randy Wolf will sign a 1-yr $5 miliion deal. Sould be announced Fri. (Ugh!). They made the same offer to Colon. They also made an offer to Kuroda. He wants more than they are willing to pay. He prefers to stay out west (Seattle). Eaton will probably start the season on the DL. His shoulder is not good but he doesn't need surgery.

2. Phils will bring in Jerry Davannon to compete for the RF platoon spot with Werth.
(Double Ugh!)

3. Will sign a reliever. Either Affeldt or someone of that ilk.

4. Are in conversations with Rowand. If they sign Rowand, they could trade Vic for a 3b-m. If not, they will look to bring in Melvin More but they want the O's to pick up some of his salary (Triple Ugh!). If a 3B-man is acquired, look for Helms to go to the Yanks for Farnsworth.

Certainly I'm ok with Rowand returning. Nothing else I've mentioned excites me much.

If DPatrone is right, and if all the predictions come true maybe he really does have a source, than I think we should take a flyer on Prior if assuming we sign Wolf. No doubt we'll have an injury in the rotation and will need the extra starter. I'm okay with Wolf if he's healthy because we could still afford to sign Rowand. Hopefully we can get Percival and have a pretty good bullpen. If we do resign Rowand I see no good reason to trade Vic because last years outfield was pretty damn good all around and we would be more or less set with a bench of Rowand, Dobbs, Bruntlett, and Coste. If we do trade Helms to the Yanks I'd prefer it be for someone that isn't Farnsworth.

Also, I don't know if this is true or not but I heard the Yanks used the picks they got when we signed Gordon to draft Ian Kennedy and Joba Chamberlain. Can anyone confirm or refute this?

Didn't mean to include Rowand on the bench list, must have been my subconcious Keith Law.

Oh I do have a source. Believe me, I'm not making this up. If I were, I'd come up with a lot better stuff than this. In addition the other than Affeldt, watch for Joe Kennedy. It won't be Percival.

After talking with my friend, Hw got the feeling Rowand really wants to return and the Phils really want him back.

His speculation on Vic being traded for a 3b-man is just that. He said the kid Teehan in KC has made it know he doesn't want to continue in RF, the KC really likes the guy palying 3rd for them right now. The Phils have admitted they want to upgrade 3B and that will likely happen via trade if at all. Helms would only be dealt in that case. Girardi loves him and will use him to be a 1b back-up.

Like I said, I'm not crazy about most of this stuff. I do believe Gillick is trying but he never seems to do enough to get the top-tier guys. Something has to be done. There's a lot of open spots on the roster right now even with the guys we know are going to be there but are not yet signed (Howard, Werth, Dobbs etc.)

My friend also said that the Angels have the upper hand to get Cabrera from Florida. He doesn't think the Dodgers will get him, which means Kemp will be in CF for LA. If Kemp does go in a possible deal LA will push hard for Rowand. His dad lives out in LA.

The Yankees did use the picks from us signing Gordon to grab Kennedy in the 1st and Chamberlain in the sandwich round. Thanks for bringing that up......would you like to kick my dog while you're at it?

If the Phillies had those 2 picks instead of the Yankees they would have drafted "toolsy" OFers who have been cut already.


Kennedy and Chamberlain both pitched for Nebraska. Not a bad staff.

The Bucs top prospect is a speedy CF, Andrew McCutchen, who seems to be on the fast track to the stadium with the yellow bridge...highly doubt they would even consider Greg "Pure Athlete" Golson in any deal for Snell...

1) For 1 yr/5 mill., Wolf would be a fine addition to the staff. Pre-LAD, he was banged around on HR/FB and GB/FB, but he could probably slop in a 4.5 era in CBP (better than phils' 4.76 team era last year). I know he had a 4.73 era in LAD last year, but his FIP was only 3.95. He has nice K/9 #'s.

My question: how is his sept. shoulder surgery?

2) Jeff DaVanon has better career LH/RH splits than Werth. Not an awful value bin pickup. He's a little below league average - 98 OPS+ - w/ a little pop and a decent eye. A Werth/DaVanon platoon in RF all year though? Ugh, that has to be below league average.

3) Affeldt 53% GB or Kennedy 49% GB. Both LH's w/ some flexibility there. Both can go in long relief or start in a pinch. I like Affeldt better. Might likely have a mid-4 era though. Still, I'm in favor of more bullpen help, especially GBallers and LH's.

4) Mora - 98 OPS+ in '07; 8 million salary
Helms - 68 OPS+ in '07; 2 million salary

Granted, Helms is likely to bounce back a bit after an awful year. Mora, despite his few "clear" years in '04-'05, is more likely a league avg 3B now, but that's all we need. And, he's a plus defender. I'm ok with it and think it's an upgrade over the current situation.

My question: how much of his salary will be picked up? How much will that change the player to be traded?

5) Mark Teahen for Victorino, if Rowand signs, is interesting. Teahen can play a little defense. Certainly better than Helms. He has upside after a disappointing year, but still might only be league average (career OPS+ 100). Vic can flat out glove, has a gun in right, and has speed for days. Interesting maneuver. Not sure how I feel about it.

DPatrone's comments from his source are almost identical to the insider on the PP board...hmm

what's the PP board?

If all that happened, and then Helms was traded for Farnsworth . . . I think that Kyle would bounce back this year. I'd be worried about his arm b/c his K/9 (10.2 career K/9 to 7.2 K/9 last year) drastically dropped last year, but, if his arm's ok, then it'd be a lot of fun to watch Farnsworth -> Lidge in CBP. Of course, after the phans get done looking at the mph gun, they'd have to turn around to watch the balls fly out of the park. Not a bad risk though, honestly. We need more arms in the pen.

Look up philsforever on the philliesphans.com board....alot of DPatrone's info is almost exactly what was said there.

DPatrone: I don't mean to doubt the validity of your source, in fact the more you mention it the more legit it seems, it's just that any blogger claiming to have an inside source should justifiably be met with some skepticism.

That said, I like Teahen if the price is right. Does your source indicate what Teahen would cost? Would it be Vic, because that would hurt our speed and our outfield defense.

Let's assume that DPatrone is right, and like I said, I'm starting to think his source is legit, that would leave us more of less with the following if (and this is a big if, we could acquire Teahen without giving up Vic):

Rotation:
Hamels
Myers
Wolf
Kendrick
Moyer

Bullpen:
CL Lidge
SU Gordon
MR Madson, Romero, Affeldt, Farnsworth
LR Durbin/Condrey/Mathieson etc.

Lineup:
SS Rollins
RF Victorino
2B Utley
1B Howard
LF Burrell
CF Rowand
3B Teahen
C Ruiz

Bench:
C Coste/Jaramillo
CIF/COF Dobbs
UT Bruntlett
OF Werth
OF Snelling

That sounds pretty good to me, and would be more or less within budget. We'd have a pretty strong bullpen and a pretty strong bench as well. If we could add Prior (as I've been advocating despite the long-shot odds) as insurance for Wolf this could be a great team. I don't know if we could get Teahen (especially without including Victorino in the deal) but he'd be a helluva pickup for 3B and still has a ton of potential. I'm not sold on Farnsworth but if we can get him and his 98mph fastball and simultaneously get rid of Helms I'm all for it.

Also, DPatrone, does your source know that you post on this blog and if so how does he feel about it?

Kerry Wood was mentioned above. He wants 2 years at $5 mill/year probably too much for Phils.

If the yanks want Helms, can't we sweeten the pot and try to get Igawa.

If they pick up additional set-up men, could we package Madson, Kendrick and prospects like Adrian Cardenas to Oakland for Haren or Baltimore for Bedard.

What's Mora's rep in the clubhouse. Good guy, professional?

I don't know about philliesphans.com board. My guy might post there. I don't know. I post on Philliestalk.com and so does he. He knows I post here and as long as I don't mention his name he's ok with it. I will say this: I don't take what I get from anywhere else. I may be a pessimist but I am not a copy-cat or lair, nor am I thinking any of you think such). Also, if I could mention the name of my source here you'd all know him. He is the legitimate article. I've been conversing with him for about 4 years now via e-mail or telephone.

Also, like I mentioned in a previous thread, I have also spoken with the guy who runs philliestalk.com. We work for the same corporation, he is PA and I here in VA. I use my real name. First name is Dom and I have nothing to hide. If any of you would like to e-mail me, contact me through philliesyalk.com. I post here, because even though I get ripped sometimes, this is a whole lot of fun. There are many more posters here than philliestalk.com, so there are more opinions. I am not a genius. I don't have a crystal ball. I just like talking Phillies baseball. I've been a phan since '66 and there is no other baseball tem for me. For now just want to wish everyone out there a Happy Thankgiving.

Pat Gillick - 1 for 2 in winning National League Eastern Divisional Championships, Ed Wade - 0 for 8 - 'nuff said - give me the risk taker any day. That said, I do want the Phils to have at least one Geoff and since Geary and Blum are now Astros, I guess it is up to Gillick to obtain Jenkins, unless Wade is going for the trifecta....

They are saying on Philliesphan that they heard on WIP we got Bedard and Mora for Victorino, Helms, Carrasco, Outman and Happ. Did anyone here this, can't find anywhere but I love getting Bedard without giving up Kendrick if true

Hit, looks like a hoax as follow-up posts say G Cobb is talking football on WIP. Frustrating when jerks just post BS.

This trade would seem too good to be true and even G Cobb would stop talking Eagles to mention the trade every now and then.

The worst part is typing into google "Bedard Phillies" gives a link to mlbtraderumors.com about an Abreu for Bedard and Gibbons.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2005/11/bobby_abreu_for.html

In real baseball news, though, Torii Hunter will be heading to the Angels...

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20071122&content_id=2306608&vkey=hotstove2007&fext=.jsp

Yeah, contract terms were not disclosed. It'll be interesting if the deal skews Rowand's deal upwards

5 years at least 80 million per ESPN. At least Rowand probably won't get 6/84, but he'll probably too rich for the Phils blood now.

Well talk about OF depth and SP depth in LA after their first 2 moves. I have to believe a Chicago or Texas or some other team in the mix will scoop up Rowand now that someone out of the blue took the best available CF

"The Angels flew into free agency late Wednesday, agreeing with longtime Twins center fielder Torii Hunter on a five-year deal thought to be worth at least $80 million."

"The Angels flew into free agency late Wednesday, agreeing with longtime Twins center fielder Torii Hunter on a five-year deal thought to be worth at least $80 million."

I'm sorry, but I very skeptical of any legitimacy to your "rumors" D.Patrone, but I'll play anyway...

1. Helms for Farnsworth, is worth the risk. We'd have both Jayson Werth and Kyle farnsWORTH then on the same team...enough said! But seriously, the guy can still rifle from the mound, and a change back to the NL may work for 1 season, and that means Stonehands is gone from the Phils...Wes was a total disappointment.

2. Joe Kennedy or Affeldt would be welcome additions to the 'pen because they're a 2nd lefty, and right now our only internal options include an injured Zarguski, Matt Smith, and wild as hell Fabio "Model Dictator" Castro.

3. Jeff Davanon can remain unsigned!

4. Melvin Mora is what the Phils need at 3rd, steady league average offense with solid defense. Not worth 8 mil in my opinion, but definite upgrade.

5. Randy Wolf is a proven commodity in the majors. I want the Phils to venture into the Japanese market, but it's very difficult to translate success over there to stats over here. I know their league have vastly improved, but when former MLB player Aaron Guiel is almost the HR champ, you know the quality of batters isn't nearly the same, plus the starting pitchers seem to wear down as compared to their relievers.

That last comment is in regards to the Phils interest in Kuroda, which I will admit does intrigue me but not at 10 million a season.

Todd Zolecki is reporting the Phillies have made an offer to Kuroda

Linebrink to Whitesox according to rotoworld.com


Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

Just got home from work and being out all day yeasterday so check this out:

My friend's dad said 950 reported (also broke that Rollins was the MVP) that we offered Outman, Savery, and Jarimillo for Ryan Zimmerman. I don't know the truth to that and would wonder why the Nationals would do a trade like that. Zimmerman would come cheap considering he hasn't signed a long-term deal yet (correct me if I'm wrong).

My friend's dad also said, as stated above, that we are making a serious run at Kuroda as well. He first told me it was a Japenese outfielder (thought it was Fukudome!) but it was really Kuroda as confirmed by Zolecki.

The trade option for Zimmerman convinces me that the Phils really are trying to pursue a above-league average 3B.

Would love Zimmerman. Being down in DC, i've heard reports that he's on the market. Not sure why, especially with the new stadium opening.

Make that Hunter 5/90. Rowand?????????

Trade the whole farm system for anything of value. There's nothing there anyway.

Don't know if its been said already, but,

Pat Gillick : GM, Seattle Mariners, 1999-2003

Chris Snelling : Signed by Mariners as an amateur free agent, 1999

Wow. Great Rumor about Ryan Zimmerman.

The Washington Nationals and Ryan Zimmerman lead the way at third base. Probabilistic Model of Range, Third Basemen, 2007.

He fielded 448 outs, when he was projected to make 403: (plus 45). 299 Total Bases. Phillies 3rd Basemen last year made 433 when they were projected to make 442 outs: (minus 9) Zimmerman raked against lefties. What an young infield that would make.

On the same tack, Shane Victorino gets to far more balls then Rowand does. If Victorino was in CF last year he would have caught 429 balls to Rowand's 392 using this same model (plus 37).

Plus 45 + 9 + 37 = 91 more outs last year would have been made by the Phillies if Zimmerman was manning the hot corner and Victorino was patrolling CF like Garry Maddox. Wow.

There is nothing wrong with rumors and speculation as long as no one here takes it seriously. Some of these rumors (Golson for Snell, anything about Bedard) are laughable yet taken seriously. The best way to know if a rumor is laughable is to put yourself in the place of the other team. If you pretend to be the Pirates GM and someone offers Golson, Happ & Jaramillo for Snell you will break out laughing. Same with the Bedard for various people rumors.

By the way the Vic for Teahen rumor is also dubious, although not laughable. Teahen set a Royals record for assists in RF last season. There is no evidence that he doesn't like playing OF and given the fact that he's developing nicely at age 26 and has about the same numbers as Vic the trade makes no sense from the Royals end UNLESS the Phils threw in a pitching prospect. THAT trade (Happ & Vic for Teahen) might make sense on both sides.

Speaking of having a good laugh:
"Yankees signed C.J. Henry to a minor league contract.
New York's first-round pick in 2005, Henry was sent to Philadelphia in the Bobby Abreu trade. He batted just .184 with an abysmal 139/18 K/BB ratio at low Single-A in 2007 before requesting that the Phillies release him. They did, perhaps thinking that he'd quit baseball to pursue a college basketball career, but instead he returns to the Yankees."

SirAlden: There is no more dubious stat than range factor. The problem is that range is NOT only affected by the player's ability. It is affected by the pitching staff, by the height of the infield grass and by who plays alongside of him. All you need to know about how bogus range factor is, is to look at how Rollins and Jose Reyes rank in Bill James RF calculations. Do you believe the stat or do you believe your eyes?

Re: The laugh meter.

I pretended to be the Nats GM. This offer didn't cause me to break out laughing. It caused me to fall off my chair, doubled over, rolling on the floor laughing.

"naylman: Outman, Savery, and Jarimillo for Ryan Zimmerman."

"The White Sox and Scott Linebrink have agreed to a four-year, $19 million deal"

This gives us an idea of what a good relief pitcher will cost.

Eyes tell us Derek Jeter is a superior defender, too.

ESPN says that Steve Finley wants to play again. How about him platooning with Werth?

GM Carson~

Just 'cause your skeptical, that does not mean the info I got isn't true. I didn't say I was happy with the stuff, I was just sharing what I was told. Now if you'd rather me not do that I won't. Now I will say that I'd like to have Kuroda over Wolf even though I know nothing about him. But think about it though, the Phils are done paying top money to anyone other Rowand (although I don't think the'll pay what he wants) and Howard. Wolf fits right in with their salary structure.

As far as Vic for Teahan, I didn't say it was a straigh-up deal. I said it could be possible IF the Phils re-signed Rowand.

I do find it difficult to understand why the Phils only want to up CF or 3B but not both. If Rowand leaves they will concentrate on 3rd. If he stays they will probably leave 3rd alone IMO.

I'm serious about this baseball team. And I will personally talk with you or any else about them. You can e-mail me through philliestalk.com if you choose. Other than that let's see how all of this plays out.

Really odd - I haven't seen any other online confirmation of this but the Jeff DaVanon entry in Wikipedia says:

"From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jeffrey Graham DaVanon (born December 8, 1973 in San Diego, California) is a Major League Baseball outfielder with the Philadelphia Phillies...He declared free agency on October 29, 2007"

Who's updating this?

Probably some sock puppet, s97. I just went to Davanon's page on Wikipedia again and now he's an Athletic. Maybe it was one of those things like Mike Lowell where the Phils had him for about an hour...

Enjoy the turkey today.

Anyone can update Wikipedia entries at any time, so they're not to be taken seriously.

You can also color me mighty skeptical about DPatrone's source. I might change my mind if I see one or two of his source's deals actually go down but, until then, I'll meet these claims with a roll of the eyes.

DaVanon, by the way, is the worst player in the history of organized baseball and, at 34 years of age, he isn't going to be getting any better. Even within the Value Village parameters in which Gillick likes to operate, he would have to be certifiably nuts to think DaVanon could help the team. Whatever his faults, I don't think Gillick is certifiably nuts.

Lekh followup:

Phils signed Gordon (type A) as a result of Wagner's free agency (type A). Phils got Mets #18 and a supplemental at 37. Yanks get Phils 20 and a supplemental 41.

Phils drafted Drabek and Cardenas. Yanks drafted Kennedy and Chamberlain. The Yanks picks were made *after* the Phils selected.

On the other hand, the Yanks picked CJ Henry with the Lieber type A compensation pick in 2005...

I also have a source inside the Phillies organization & he told me they're very close to a deal that would send Golson, Eaton, Ennis, Jaramillo, & T.J. Bohn to the Twins for Santana and Joe Maurer. I expect you all to be skeptical but my source assures me it's practically a done deal.

b_a_p,

Rockin' source. Maybe we can get Nick Punto back as well, to man the hot corner.

BAP, I believe the Twinkies are throwing in Francisco Liriano into the deal, too. I'm just sayin'...

Interesting article on Snelling's injury history.

http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/2007/022007/02162007/260330

ESPN says that Steve Finley wants to play again. How about him platooning with Werth?

this is a joke, right?

Steve Finley would be an horrible addition. Just look at his stats from 2006: .246/.320/.394 (in 426 ABs)

2007: .181/.245/.245 (in 94 ABs)

Yikes.

Oh, and he's 42/

Dpatrone gave us some information last year that was supposed to have come from inside sources. Do we know how good or close he came to trades or signings?

Mike H: It's funny you should mention Liriano because my source tells me that his name came up too. But the Phillies would have to throw in LaForest, which my source tells me would be a deal-killer.

People have to ask themselves why guys like Bedard or Zimmerman would even be on the market. Does that make the slightest bit of sense - struggling franchises aiming to offer up the best, established young talent they have going for them? One might say, that's what Florida is doing with Cabrera - but that's Florida. The Orioles, bad as they are, have never operated that way, and the nationals are about to open a new stadium. Why would you take a chance on prospects for a 23-year old cleanup hitter who's already the cornerstone and identity of your franchise? Be reasonable.

On a different subject, can the Phillies really afford to have platoons at 2 different positions? Let's say they acquire Geoff Jenkings (just to throw out a name). Jenkins & Dobbs would start whenever they're facing a right-hander & they would undoubtedbly bat very near each other in the order. Come the 6th inning, the opposing manager brings in a lefty, which means Cholly has to counter by bringing in Helms & Werth. That leaves a 3-man bench -- with one of those 3 being the backup catcher & another being the light-hitting Eric Bruntlett.

The Phillies might be able to get away with a platoon at one position, but 2 strikes me as a real stretch.

BAP - I would agree with you normally, but the 1993 Phillies platooned at 3 positions - 2b (Duncan/Morandini), LF (Thompson/Inky) and RF (Eisey/Chamberlain). Worked out okay. Not saying it is the best idea, but it worked at a more extreme level before.

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