Part of

« Segovia earns baseball-best 16th victory | Main | Two out of three ain't bad »

Saturday, August 12, 2006


I'm not expecting a win tonight. The Reds have seen their fortunes fall and this is one chance to make a stand against a minor league pitcher.

Ramirez has not pitched well against the Phils. They have a good chance to place themselves in position to tie with the Reds come tommorow

If Mathieson keeps having a solid inning or 2 before faultering he will find himself in the bullpen.

Easy threw that right in J-Roll's kitchen... inner half and belt high. Hang onto your favorite beverage of choice, fellas. First one to 10 wins?

i think its first one to 15 wins the way this game is going

i think its first one to 15 wins the way this game is going

sorry for the double post

Mathieson's got good stuff. His problem is he only has 2 pitches. His attempts at a change-up were feeble. You can't be a major league starter with 2 pitches unless your stuff is world class. I think he'll be an effective reliever for the Phils someday, maybe a very solid setup man.

mathieson's still young enough to develop a change up and he seems to be having some of the problems hamels had when he was first called up. he is relying too much on two pitches and not throwing enough strikes

The intersting thing to take note of now that the Phillies have re-emerged as contenders, is what Gillick will do in reaction to it. I believe he felt, as most of the rest of us did in late July, that they had no real chance. But now they are clearly in the thick of things. Would he possibly try to make a move to help the team now - even a minor one - instead of looking to 2008? It's a peculiar predicament. Gillick wants to see if Mathieson can pitch and maybe gain experience for the future; meanwhile, he's clearly not ready for prime time and his presence in the rotation is hurting the team's chances of winning now. What to do? You can't pretend to ignore the fact that your team is two games out of a playoff spot, and yet you also can't just reverse your position and try to add the type of players you just got rid of two weeks ago.

If I were Gillick, I'd not try to make any moves that ran contrary to his stated plan at the time of the Abreu trade - but I also wouldn't let people like Mathieson and Nunez founder and hinder this year's team try to compete for the wild-card. If any other options may exist within the organization - like Germano or Scales - I'd try them.

i am not convinced how good germano would do and after him it doesn't seem like they have a replacement for mathieson.

I agree - he needs a third pitch. He'll never be a pinpoint accuracy guy, not with that heat he throws.

If Gillick does anything, it will be from a position of who is hurt or tired right now. I doubt he'd pull anyone in the middle of "their audition."

I don't think there's much Gillick can do about the rotation. maybe Lopez of the Orioles could be had for cheap? I remember hearing his name mentioned a lot at the deadline.

Nunez, however, is really another story - I have to think Gillick could flip a marginal prospect for a replacement-level 3B (like Randa or Castilla, as mentioned in the last post). that could be a great move...

ae: I'm a Randa guy, but don't like Lopez at all. The thing that makes me think Mathieson will someday be a solid contributor is his K/IP ratio.

After trading Bell, it would make no sense to trade for another 3B as a short term basis. Especially if you haft to give up a prospect.

Mathieson maybe better suited as a reliever. In my opinion he may standout doing that - even this year.

If Mathieson makes it to the 25-man roster, he'd be nice out of the pen come playoff time.

Wow 3 strong innings for Geary. He really excells as a reliever. Fultz also has had at least a decent season (more so lately).

Freaking STUD! The Howitzer BOOMS AGAIN!

I think its time to send Mathieson down to AAA again for some pitch development and confidence-building. Tonight was Mathieson's second straight early exit, and I didn't see Mathieson hitting the gun with his fast ball tonight at higher than 93 m.p.h. With only a fastball and a hard slider, the guy's going to continue to get eaten up, until he gets an "out" pitch. I think its time to go with some other starting pitching option, in the short term at least, as Mathieson is proving less and less effective, with each time out now.

Oh . . CLUTCH BLAST BY HOWARD . . .BACK TO THE TELEVISION!! More extra innings tonight? As long as they win.

They need to send Mathieson down after tonight. Like Clout said, he has two pitches and needs more time to cook. It's worth giving someone else a try, maybe a hot hand like Segovia, or Brian Mazone, who must be doing something right at AAA (10-2, 2.12 ERA).

One thing to also consider is that no other contender really has a fifth guy either. It makes sense to go with the hot hand.

Mike I agree with you. Now we see Gordon getting into trouble again.

Gordon is so flat right now. There's nothing there.

Too bad they didn't keep Lidle, huh?
P.S. I understand why Howard hesitated to throw to Rollins to force Hatteburg with Freel on 3rd but he had Hatteburg dead and I would've taken my chances on Rollins throw to the plate. It could've been a triple play and they'd be out of the inning.

Welcome to Philadelphia, Tom Gordon.


Very worrisome performances by Gordon last night and tonight . . . tonight more than anything. Unless Gordon turns it around, if the Phillies have no effective closer, they're toast. Gordon looked like he was 2-5 m.p.h. down from his usual top end. I hope he isn't having secret arm problems.

Gordon's doing his best Wagner impression right now.

I wonder if one of our interview questions to closers is "do you enjoy complete meltdowns in consecutive games against the leading wild-card team?"

Point taken on Lidle, Clout. At least Lidle was good for 5-7 innings and "only" 3-5 runs given up over that space.

I'd prefer a clubhouse low on ice cream and loudmouth pilots. But that's just me...

I wonder if Howard doesn't trust his own throw in that situation. He's bungled that play a couple times this season.

I can't even begin to understand what Gordon's problem is now. I was theorizing tired arm, but that's almost impossible--before last night, he hadn't thrown for a week, and he's on a pace for his fewest innings since 2001 when he was coming off arm surgery. Something weird has to be up, his stuff is SERIOUSLY off. I'm very surprised Manuel would send him out again, in fact I'm puzzled as to why we didn't use someone like Castro earlier in the game--Castro has not pitched poorly, and would be entirely fresh.

Jason: Good point. His D hasn't been great and he may have some confidence issues.

That JRoll's in a zone!!!

This power spurt by Rollins may convince someone he should bat 6th or 7th instead of leadoff.

C'mon Chase!

They're teasing us . . .smart HBP by Utley in not getting out of the way.

Well, the offense gave it all you can ask that game. I'd go to war with these bats in a playoff series. I don't know that I'd say the same for our closer. It's not a coincidence that Gordon's flattest efforts this season came in games like this.

It seems to me that arm issues . . tired arm, sore arm, etc., have to be behind Gordon's implosions. In fact, Gordon may not even be sharing all of it with Phillies trainer staff, as strange as that might sound.

I agree with the tired arm synopsis. His fastball is straight as string thru the hitting zone. Hopefully, it's something that a few days off could cure.

Mad dog Madsen could close a couple of games.

What a blast by Little Papi! Go 6!

Little Papi? cmon it has been The Reaper for like 96 hours already!

I don't like the Reaper name. It's too grim...ha ha!

Tough loss. Looking at the bright side we have Myers vs Eric "Homerun" Milton. I like our chances. 2-3 from the Reds will be huge. Did anyone catch Kalas getting snippy w/ Wheels during the 8 th inning? Wheels was explaing how the Phills 9th inning batting order changed w/ Victorino staying in the game-which Kalas attempted to explain beforehand. pretty funny. I like both of the them-but they obviously have disliked each other for years. I think it started w/ kalas getting caught cheating on the missus on the road?

Chris Wheeler is a fookin tool.

The people at PhilliesPhans posted some stats on Gordon that support injury. To the naked eye, his stuff does look flat.

April: 0.84 ERA, 0.88 WHIP, .114 OP BA, 17K/5BB
May: 2.19 ERA, 1.07 WHIP, .213 OP BA, 14K/3BB
June: 2.70 ERA, 1.10 WHIP, .229 OP BA, 10K/3BB
July: 4.63 ERA, 1.70 WHIP, .288 OP BA, 14K/4BB
August: 10.71 ERA, 1.67 WHIP, .300 OP BA, 5K/2BB

Whether the issue is physical or mental, something is off.

From what I see of him, my first thought would be physical, given that just about all of his pitches seem to have lost their bite and his fastball has lost speed. But I trouble believing that Gordon of all people would hide an injury, or that the Phillies would pitch him through a minor injury given our investment in him and Gillick's decree that he does not plan on stressing over contending this year (or even the next). Plus, if he had injuries, you'd think the week off he was given would heal anything less than something requiring a DL stint. I can only guess that it's either mental or just regressing to the mean--he was pitching above his ceiling for the year and now is falling back to earth, fast. If he has a tired arm with only 47 IP or whatever, he is damaged goods and despite his great first half performance, the 3 year contract was a big mistake.

Mathieson looked pretty overmatched tonight. Unfortunately, I think the Phils' might need to send him out there for another start due to the shear lack of alternatives.

What is a realistic alternative? Mazone? No. Floyd? Want to see him up in Sept. but flowing him into a pressure situation is a recipe for diaster. Madson? He was a wreck as a starter and the bullpen needs his arm down the stretch. Maybe they reach for Zagovia but I doubt he is really ready. Can't imagine him being alot better than Mathieson at thie point.

This team gave up on this season when they traded their veterans. Good or Bad. I don't want to hear Drama Queen, RSB, Tim, and the like now complain that the Phils don't have the players to make the WC. People can't have their cake and eat it too.

The worst move (or nonmove) that Gillick actually might have ended up making was not trading Gordon. Prime dictum when trading is sell high and Gordon's highest value was at the All-Star break.

Although the trading deadline market for closers was pretty limited, I can't imagine the Phils couldn't have moved Gordon for something that would have helped this club next year.

If Gordon does turn out to have an injury, I would not be surprised. Besides his age, Torre just absolutely drove Gordon's arm into the ground during '04 & '05. One of Torre's worst managing traits is that the gets locked into one or two setup guys and just uses them game in and game out. By the time the playoffs rolled around, Gordon was absolutely useful due to his dead arm. Remember him getting absolutely shelled in the '04 ALCS vs. the Sox.

Believe me, MG, you won't hear me whining if they don't make the wild card. If they do, that's nice. If not, oh well. I still think Gillick did the right thing. This is a team that needs to be built for the long haul, annual wild-card illusions be damned.

I think people are giving Gordon a bit of a premature raw deal here. It'd be one thing if this had been going on for a month. It's back-to-back games, and not well-timed. But there's no evidence to suggest he's suddenly "damaged goods", and that they should have traded him when they had the chance. He's been awesome this year, and he'll be valuable for the Phillies down the stretch. You need a closer if you're going win. The Phillis have nothing resembling a replacement for him. Gordon's presence is not a luxury. He hasn't broken down once this year, and has been available to pitch every time they've needed him. Cut him some slack if he happens to falter somewhat in mid-season.

Segovia is out as a possible Mathieson replacement. From the Reading Eagle this morning:

"The latest loss is ace pitcher Zack Segovia, who was granted a leave of absence for the rest of the season to pitch for the U.S. team in the 2008 Olympic qualifier in Cuba. Segovia, who allowed two hits in seven innings in Friday's 1-0 win over Harrisburg, is 11-5 for the Phillies and ranks first in organized baseball with 16 wins this season."

MG- I'm not going to complain about the Phillies not having the players to make the Wild Card. Don't put words in my mouth! And by the way, my wife made some tastey Banana Cake last night, and I had two slices, so kiss my ass!

About Mathieson- as much as I like guys learning at the Big League level, it's time for him to return to Scranton for the time being. I do NOT want to see Floyd back, rather Germano or Mazone as mentioned above. Mazone is 30, and is working some kinda magic in Triple A, so give him a shot, what's the worst that can happen, he surrenders 6 runs in 3+ innings...that's what Mathieson's been doing, the guy he would replace.

In reference to Gordon
At the end of July he let up runs in 3 straight games. Then the next 4 were scoreless. now these last 2 he let up some more runs to get a BS and L.

Maybe he is just tired and needs a rest.

DQ I agree to give Mazone or Germano a shot at SP. Give Mathieson some time at AAA to see if he rights himself. I do believe he could make a great relief pitcher even this year.

Another good outing by the Phils pen besides Gordon. Concerned about number of games and innings for Geary. Agree with consensus that Matheison should be sent down to AAA. I would have Madson take Matheison's spot in the rotation and use roster spot for another positional player -- perhaps Scales. Bench is so thin that Nunez cannot even be pinch hit for now.

Well, here it is once again!! Howard vs. Guardado. What will happen??

Tie game!! Ryan comes through this time!!

The comments to this entry are closed.

EST. 2005

Top Stories


Rotoworld News

Follow on Twitter

Follow on Facebook

Contact Weitzel