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Monday, July 17, 2006


yeh, the best thing to do when making roster moves is to move down a guy hitting 300+.

Nunez and Roberson should be on the short list of people moved down. options or no options.

Roberson's back in Scranton. He was optioned back to make room for Lieberthal. Ruiz was also sent back down to make room for Myers. Even with his .133, I'd still rather keep the utility player Nunez over Fasano. Maybe a trade is coming.

Ruiz should be playing. That said, since apparently he won't be for the immediate future, why not play Fasano? I think Coste can play third base, keep him and get rid of Nunez.

there's no need to keep 3 catchers on this roster.

coste can also play 3b, 1b and the corner outfield positions.

and is hitting 300.

i guess that you need another middle infielder...

if the call is seriously between coste and fasano, i cant see keeping the meatballer. sal's pal's or not.

I saw (heard) part of the Fox broadcast by Lou Pinella, and I was not impressed with his comments. Maybe it is just his speech pattern...I don't know, but he could not pronounce the names Lidle, or Burrell, and commented that Rollins was the only base stealer on the team. He also heard the Phils have a pretty nice home ballpark. Yes, we know he managed in Seattle, he told us enough times.

I had the opposite impression of Lou's broadcast. I personally couldn't care less if he knows how to pronounce the players' names; hearing him ridicule the Phils' performance with RISP was fun (and apparently, they heard him from the broadcast booth). And at least twice during the broadcast, he called what was going to happen on the field. (i.e. "This is going to be a pitch inside", and it was.)

I said the Nunez signing was a bad one on the day it was announced. You can find it right here on beerleaguer. He was a mediocre utilityman coming off a career year who would most likely revert to his norm: .240, no power, horrible OB and a glove that's just average. But having said that, they can't cut him to make room for Fasano. They have no one else who can back up at SS and 2B. Personally, I'd cut Fasano and go with Leiby & Coste. If you trade Leiby or Coste reverts to his mean, then you have Ruiz in reserve. Then in the off-season you trade for or sign a new catcher. If you plan to rebuild next year, you could probably get by for a year with Coste/Ruiz since it doesn't much matter on an 85-loss team.

Abreu - Extension through '11? Does anyone know if Boras is his agent? If that demand holds up their trading him, then for the rest of this year I'd sit him until he bats lead-off or 2nd. If he's gonna be a greedy idiot, then he doesn't deserve to play. Period.

Fasano - personally, I love the guy, but man he hasn't played well enough to keep him over Coste. This will be indicative of the next couple weeks of Gillick's moves. Should we start a pool to see if they designate Coste for assignment and then Texas picks him up?

Clout I agree with you. Ruiz/Coste is probably better than Fasano/Leiberthal. Ruiz has legitamate potential and Coste has a strong arm and versatility.
Its time for the Phils to start those trades if they are going to do them. Especially if they can make room to keep Ruiz in the ML.

i think that they still have options on coste...

and, "my sources say" that they're prbly gonna move coste down.

which is a god damn shame.

You might be right on Coste. I don't know what the rule is for someone like him.

I think the pitchers are calling all the shots at catcher, and it's a shame because they aren't good enough to be given such concessions. I don't think they have the patience to work with Ruiz, a Latino rookie. I'm basing this on two factors:

1. Players call the shots on this team, not Manuel.

2. Lieber has had a personal catcher since last season. Lidle is also fussy with who he works with. They are the veterans.

For what it is worth, Baseball America named Carlos Ruiz as it's catcher on the AAA mid-season all-star team. Why not give him some playing time?

re ruiz:

he's gotten two shots in the bigs this season, and has performed worse than 3 other catchers.

he aint there yet.

He should be getting it. I didn't know he was sent down and it's not good news.

Just to be perfectly clear I do not believe that Ruiz has the talent to be a decent everyday catcher in the bigs. However, I DO think he can be a decent backup and the Phils ought to give him a shot and see what he can do. I feel exactly the same way about Coste. Neither has the ability to start, each could be a decent backup and deserves some PT.

The difference being that Coste is surely nearing the end of his admittedly brief professional career. To me, the question of replacing one of two (any two) old, bad catchers with a young, bad but potentially good catcher should be a no-brainer.

are you guys actually paying attention to Coste's and Ruiz's actual, you know, performance?

Coste has been quoted as saying he wants to play another 5-6 years, in the bigs.

i have seen nothing from him that suggests that he doesnt belong in the majors.

let me back up, everything that i've seen from coste shows me that he's got what it takes to be an every day contributor (read: starter) in the pros.

what exactly are you seeing in coste that makes him value-less? hell, what do you see in him that makes him a backup?

and please, specifics, perofrmance-based.

Well, there's not much of a case to be made either way for him based purely on performance, because he hasn't played that much in the bigs. If he keeps up his current pace, then surely the Phils will have lucked out. But we'll see if that actually happens (I seem to remember him struggling more than a little a few weeks ago). Either way, I don't see the purpose of keeping Lieberthal or Fasano in favor of Ruiz at this point in the season.

Joe: I don't believe 49 MLB plate appearances are a good indicator of what someone can produce as an everyday player. Coste is a minor league veteran, an undrafted free agent, cut by four organizations who was forced to play several years in indy ball. Maybe he is the 1 in a million guy who suddenly puts it all together at age 33. But the odds say he isn't.

ruiz and coste have had almost the same number of at bats (44/48). coste is at .313, ruiz is at .205 (fasano: .243, lieby at .226)

if i were making the calls, i'd be splitting time between Lieby and Coste .. at least until lieby gets hurt again in a week or two.

ruiz is barely hitting over mendoza, and i cant really say that i've been impressed with his pitcher handling and defense.

i'm beginning to think that Chris Coste is the Rodney Dangerfield of baseball.

He hits 0.472 in spring training... and gets sent down.

he's hitting 0.313, and he's going to be sent down...

Why are people drinking the Coste kool-aid? He is hitting over .300 but he doesn't bring anything else to the table. Coste's SLG percentage is awful. He has absolutely no power and doesn't hit 2Bs. Additionally, Coste never walks and doesn't work the count. Coste also is average defensively and on the basepaths.

Maybe Coste is better than Fasano but that is not saying a whole lot.

Heard that story that Abreu might be willing to waive his trade clause if he gets a contract extension until '11. Is Abreu or his agent crazy? Abreu is a good player but he will be overpaid next year at $15 million/year let alone if he gets his option picked up at $16 million in '08.

One thing I think that also get missed in the whole Abreu trade rumors is that he is unlikely to go to the Mets or Yanks. Yeah, both teams have huge payrolls but both are kind of barren on the prospect front. Additionally, if Abreu privately moans about the Philly media/fans, what until he gets to NY. Wait until Abreu strikes out in a big situation with the Yanks and gets ripped by the WFAN and NY Post for the next 2 or 3 days.

I am getting the bad feeling that that both Abreu and Burrell will be on the Phils come Aug. 1st. Besides the actual contracts, I have a bad feeling that those no trade clauses will be the true stumbling block. Absolutely assine that Wade gave them to both players.

MG: Your analysis of Coste is correct. Not sure why you're in such a hurry to subtract Abreu & Burrell. Given the track record, how can possibly think the Phils will get fair value? Are you in the blow-it-up, lose-90- games-for-the-next-3-years camp? You honestly think that the Phils can get players to play the OF corners who'll be better than Abreu & Burrell?

As much as Burrell & Abreu drive us crazy, let's not forget one important fact: The reason this team stinks is the pitching rotation absolutely SUCKS. We ought to be subtracting those bums before we throw away Abreu & Burrell.

Whether the MLB players contract and associated MLB rules permit the Phillies to "option" Coste to Scranton Wilkes-Barre, and thus, in essence, "freeze" Coste in the minors, while keeping him on the Phillies 40-man roster, I think that would be the greatest injustice which has been done to Coste this year. And that is really saying something. After being hit with that brutal blow of being the Phillies' final cut after ST, following the "eleventh hour" Delucci trade, for Coste to be "stashed" in the minors, by being "optioned" out, instead of being exposed to waivers in being designated for assignment, that would be the *worst injustice* of all for the guy. Coste has already demonstrated that he can be of great help to the Phillies, and I don't think that Coste's throwing arm, or his versatility in being able to play third base, first base, and even second base, and two outfield positions, is lost on other major league teams, particularly those in the National League, where late innings player substitutions are key. I say Coste would attract at least a handful of claims, if he shouild be designated for assignment. Again, I don't know whether the MLB players contract and/or MLB rules even *permit* a 33-year-old rookie to be "optioned" out, but in Coste's case, the Phillies, at the very least, owe Coste access to the waiver wire, if they are foolish enough to no longer want him on their 25-man active roster.

yeh, at this point coste should be demanding an outright release from the phils.

MG: To employ the converse of Clout's comment above, MG, "your analysis of Coste is *not* correct." If Coste's slugging percentage (.356) is "awful", what does that say about Lieberthal's slugging average (.312)? What about Coste's productivity as a hitter, with Coste's 8 RBI's in 48 at bats, compared with Lieberthal's 10 RBI's in almost twice as many (93) at bats? And Coste has scored 6 runs, while Lieberthal has scored only 4 runs. In Coste's last 10 games he is hitting .406, with seven RBI's. And Coste has thrown baserunners out at 38%, while Lieberthal has thrown them out at 29%, and Fasano 28%. And Coste does have power. Coste hit 20 home runs with 89 RBI's in AAA last year, and at least one of Coste's doubles in the bigs went off the outfield fence (Toronto), with at least of Coste's "fly outs" having literally pushed the center fielders' backs to the wall. Whatever roster moves are made by the Phillies when Fasano is ready to come off the DL, sending Coste down, or away, should not be one of them. Fortunately, though, it does appear that Phillies management may just be ready to do the right thing here. As the Marcus Hayes report in today's Daily News states, in pertinent part, "Assistant general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said the team might carry three catchers when Fasano returns, meaning 33-year-old rookie Chris Coste could stay around, though they have a small problem with their ability to juggle their pitching staff."

I don't want to see the Phils move Burrell & Abreu traded for anything but the Phils need help at alot of positions, including starting pitching. Since this farm system is not going to turn out anything to help this team next year, the Phils have either two options to improve the team next year: Free Agency or Trades.

Burrell and Abreu are both good players but they are both overpaid. Burrell's contract in particular is a real killer. These contracts handicap this team and prevent them from making a big-time move. Additionally, besides Gordon, these two players are the best options to get some starting pitching in return.

As for Liebethal, he is stealing money this season. I don't know if his body is just plain broken down or if he doesn't care. I kind of think it is a combination. Lieberthal is a loser and this team will not miss him in any regards next season.

Phils should trade Fasano to Pat's for a few dozen cheesesteaks and a side order to be named later.

with, or without?

Phils should still have options on Coste. But do they need 13 pitchers (8 relievers) on their active roster ? I agree they will do the wrong thing and send Coste down, leaving them with just 4 bench players. I would look to trade or release one of their fringe relievers (Fultz or White).

Most teams carry 6 or 7 relievers? I don't remember. But most teams have starting pitchers that can last 6+ innings. The Phillies do need a lot of arms in their bullpen because of their sorry starters.
And Nunez needs to go. Just cut him. The season is more than half over. He isn't hitting .250
There is no excuse.
And, no, I don't care who replaces him.

More specifically, Nunez is hitting .133,with 4 RBI's in 105 at bats, and with a .165 on base percentage. Nunez has not had a hit in a month, since June 18th! Is there anything more we need to know on July 17th, with the season more than half over?

Sorry, yeah, I meant he's not even hitting .150 but my fingers apparently didn't believe what my brain was telling them to type.
over .200 would acctually look good for him right now!

Nunez is absolutely brutal. He must be the one who goes. It shouldn't even be a question, but this is the Phillies we are talking about, and nothing is a given with this team.

I also think Fasano should be in the minors. For what its worth, he should be backing up Ruiz and not starting! How sad is that. Debating which player (Fasano or Nunez) should be on the Phillies major league roster when neither are really deserving. Ruiz should be up here over both of those two bums, but again this is the Phillies we are talking about...

Re: Nunez. You can't replace someone with no one. Maybe the Phils can scan the waiver wire for a vet backup middle INF or get one as a throw in if they make a trade. Lieby isn't tradeable so, like it or not, he plays the rest of the year. I'd keep both Ruiz and Coste as backups and cut Fasano. The pitchers who'd bitch are having bad years anyway, so I'd ignore them.

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